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2020 update : JC Verdier La Platine

A recent encounter with a JC Verdier dealer as well as a recent Audiogon discussion thread led to the start of this thread. He was in my house updating my La Platine which had been in storage for ten years with thread and oil. While he has high regards for the deck, his newer clients nevertheless prefer a Techdas iii than an 'old' La Platine. Given the proliferation of expensive decks in the past dozen years, La Platine has become very much under-appreciated. 

It's clear to me that the influence of the La Platine is everywhere to be found. Specifically, the magnetic suspension system that was employed 30+ years ago. Even SOTA offers their newer decks with mag. lev. features. And if you read this review: https://www.callas-audio.nl/Callas%20Platine%20Mod%20Kit%20Review.pdf, the Continuum Caliburn uses the same concept, which was not acknowledged in Fremer's review, albeit with more sophisticated , and expensive, execution.

It is also clear to me that there is much misunderstanding of the workings of the La Platine. I for one have contributed to this. The motor of the La Platine, for example, has been much maligned. The thread drive is another aspect of the turntable that have been described as inferior. With regard to the motor and thread drive, I have been set straight by Chris @ct0517 and Lyubomir @lbelchev. Experimenting with the different types of silk threads, the tightness to the platter  and a renewed understanding of the soundness of the Philips motor have been rewarded with better dynamics and transparency. 

The funny thing is that during the past two years of re-engagement with audio, I have questioned ownership of every components in my arsenal except the La Platine. It has always been a keeper. I wonder if La Platine owners would contribute to celebrating this 'old' deck with tales, advice, and insights?

Cheers!
ledoux1238
pani
1,218 posts
 
I admire your enthusiasm for this classic turntable. I was using the Nouvelle Platine upgraded by Keith Aschenbrenner of Auditorium 23 for about 5 years. I have also heard the Platine multiple times. You are absolutely correct on few things:

1. The suspension and low noise string drive allows the platine to provide a very silent background on which instruments float.

2. Replacing the suspension with any rigid cone or stillpoints makes the sound dry

3. Changing the string for fishing line, rubber belts or any such thing ended in an inferior sound

However, here is the thing about the sound of the Verdier which cannot be rectified. It sounds slow. The pitch is not true. I am very sensitive to accuracy of PRAT. It is a foundational attribute. Even a basic television or a $100 player gets it and thats why we are able to enjoy music on such elementary sources. Unfortunately, Verdier and many other players in the "high-end" do not keep the pitch and time. Probably because the designers have always chased the goals of an ultra silent, impressive playback. To me they are designers but they do not have the ear for accuracy of music. The world of audio is all filled with such people who do not get the structure of music and unfortunately at the helm of designs of the most expensive audio equipments. Same goes to reviewers who review these products. BTW, I did enjoy my time with Verdier, always knowing what it is missing. In the process I too tried all the tweaks like you and other Verdier owners.

Now I use a Jean Nantais Reference Lenco MK2. Not as quiet as Verdier but it plays music without the structure 
ledoux1238 OP
278 posts
 
@pani
During the past long weekend here, it was spent carefully listening for the ‘ slowness ‘  you mentioned in the belt-drive format. Frankly without  a direct comparison, I do not hear it. My sole experience with idler drive is from a Garrard 301 front end and  mostly vintage components. The sense of drive and power in the music was palpable. I remember coming away appreciating the system, but not thinking it superior. That was just one experience in a unfamiliar system. 

But your comments has gotten me researching Idler drive and DD. My enthusiasm for the Verdier is partly due to the amount of research devoted to understanding the TT. I bought the turntable knowing only one salient feature, its magnetic drive. And throughout the twenty years of ownership ( with several years in storage ) many features were experimented upon. The game of audio, for me, is first the love of music, of course.  Even more, it is an intellectual pursuit, a sense of discovery through music and its mechanical reproduction. I do believe I will be venturing into the other two drive systems.
pani
1,218 posts
 
@ledoux1238, I get your sentiments. Since you are happy to explore and experiment, here are some more things I tried with the Verdier:

1. Changed the motor from the low torque philips to a high torque Maxon motor. Currently these are used in top TTs like Kronos. I did not change the motor housing. I just replaced the motor and added the feature to connect a battery based 12v power supply to it.

2. Initially I used a deep cycle 12v battery (used in high end health care systems). Their voltage does not drop or fluctuate.

3. I also connected a high quality capacitor bank between the battery and the motor. At each step in this experiment, the sound did improve but it did not change the fundamental character of the presentation.

4. I also tried photovoltaic cells for the purest possible power to the motor.

5. I added a 30kg flywheel in between the motor and TT for higher energy drive. 

Here is a system of a friend of mine who also uses Nouvelle platine verdier and incorporates all the tweaks I mentioned and a little more. Please watch the video till the end:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qkk0zoSBSJw
lbelchev
64 posts
 

1. Changed the motor from the low torque philips to a high torque Maxon motor.
@pani,

The motor used in the Platine Verdier is a powerful, HIGH torque, LOW inertia, core-less DC regulated motor.
pani
1,218 posts
 
No, it is a low inertia Philips motor. The maxon is about 3 times more powerful
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