Another streaming newbie


Guys, I have tried to search and figure this out, because I know this topic has been well-covered. But I am still wandering in the dark, so plz forgive my redundant questions....

First, here's my current rig,: I built a Lenco table 15 yrs ago with a JMW 10 arm/London Super Gold that I run into a phono pre that I built from a pretty high end kit  (can't see the name, have no idea what it is now!) thru a VTL tube IT-85 integrated amp and then thru some SF Electa Amator II, supported by a sub I built.  So pretty mid-fi setup, but it really works for me.  Sounds great, to my ears.  

The Covid thing has me home (no golf in Los Angeles!), listening to music more. Would love to stream something that approaches the vinyl sound quality with a music service, but being retired, budget is more a concern now... I just subscribed to TIDAL with its premium level (MQA) that I was running straight from my iphone 6 to the VTL. Meh.  Then my daughter ran same stuff through her iphone 11 and, hey, that sounded better.  So, clearly, I am in need of a streaming DAC.  

I know MQA gets mixed reviews. I have no way really to test this or to go listen to stuff. Everything is shut down here. So here's the criteria that matters most to me:
  • A great UI app because now streaming is like going to the Smithsonian.  There's a lot to organize. 
  • Great sound. (whatever that means!) 
  • One box.  Cables get expensive & messy.  
  • I'd like to keep it under $2K. I'd really like to keep it under $1K, but that may be wishful thinking.  I mean, is Bluesound Node 2 up to it? I am sure it would beat my daughters iphone 11, but ... what are reasonable streamers/DACS?  Where's the killer solution that isn't $10K?  I know it's out there....
I am not so far into TIDAL that I can't change. My system is in the same room as my router, so I can run an ethernet cable to the DAC.  As I have looked at all of this, it has occurred to me to get an older, much higher quality used DAC that I can somehow mesh with TIDAL (or another service with high quality streaming) and forget the MQA.  But this has to somehow hook into my internet directly and be able to be run by a remote UI.  So now my head is spinning.

Thanks for your input.  Chuck
chuckccs
Do you mind explaining this one a bit more?  I don't think the analog analogy is the best one to use here since we are talking digital and ones and zeros.  The reason a high end cdp cost so much mostly the dac, you can only do so much with the rest of the internals to improve sound-wise.  

Using a great UI with proper connections with an upgraded DAC doesn't seem anywhere near as bad as you are suggesting but if it is I would like to know why.

Some have suggested buying a Bluesound and an external DAC. If you like the Bluesound app and the Bluesound's features, an external DAC can provide better sound quality.  

But like the rest of your system, everything matters. If you're looking for the best sound quality, skip the Bluesound.  

Adding an expensive DAC to the Bluesound is kind of like putting a $1,000 cartridge on a $500 turntable. Sure, it'll sound better than the stock cart it came with, but you won't come close to what that $1,000 cartridge is capable of, because the turntable isn't up to the task.

Only your ears can tell you if something sounds good enough.  The 2i has received many positive reviews and you can start there with the confidence most everyone here has expressed.  Both Tidal and Qobuz have trial offers and can be run on the BlueOS from your phone.  I grew up with vinyl and always loved the discography and gatefold covers.  Qobuz does a great job of providing artist and songwriter info and for me was the reason I chose Qobuz. Based on your genre selections and albums selections they recommend albums and play lists.  I have not felt like spending more for ROON (yet).   At first I thought I wanted Tidal because MQA sounded great and the file sizes were smaller (less broadband cost).  What I found out was I have never used more than 25% of my monthly broadband playing hi-rez files from Qobuz and it sounds great.  Give your current system a chance.  First things to consider are better RCA interconnects and power cord.  Upgrading is "a dish best served cold" if you get my drift.
Ah, hell, no going back to sleep!

@headphonedreams @richtruss @djones51 I spent hours last night looking at raspberry pi based players. I have a little diy in me (Lenox, phono pre, subwoofer which all work great, great value and sound) so. Seems aloo is in Bangalore India (where I have been!) and may be pretty shut down for now. But my daughter’s very serious boyfriend is an engineer and we might even build player and dac. (TBD!) Which breaks all my rules I set out. Question: so the ipad/iPhone ((Surface? I have a surface, wife has iPad) connects to the player ... how? The player has Ethernet cable in, but how do controller/player talk?

@big_greg I take your point re Bluesound. The key to my current system working is all the pieces fit nicely. I actually bought/sold some more expensive gear because it didn’t mesh. I sort of have to balance convenience vs quality vs cost. As I learn I have of course gone back and forth on this and unclear where I will land. A part of me says start w/bluesound and see - easiest pathway, but I am betting it would be like training wells. 
@macrojack I have the M10 on my spreadsheet of options, looked up the blue book for my vtl (worth more now than I paid for it 15 yrs ago!) But two real questions. First I am not dumping my phone preamp that I built! I don’t care if it’s great or awful. I built it plus Lenco and am totally attached to them. I even debated selling all my vinyl rig/albums but no! No! Too sentimental. Second: putting this system together- it’s a ‘system’ that works together. I had other tube amps along the way and never liked them. (But regret selling the Granite monoblocks!) So how a new major piece would sound to me is a big question. There’s just no way to know. But the simplicity is a big plus. So it’s on the spreadsheet and still in play. The other point I keep thinking is if I got this streaming rig really good, I know the table would not get a lot of play. So there is that, too. 
Good thing we’re in the middle of a @$#% pandemic. Lot of time to chew on this! 

I also suggest trying a Bluesound Node 2i.  It only costs $550 and it is a great place to start.  I talked to the manufactures rep and it appears they came up with a design that is a good as a unit costing three times as much.  I don't care what people say, I can hear the difference MQA.  It sounds they it was intended to sound.  Just wish I knew more about how it was developed.  Perhaps someone can explain this to me.  This hobby continues to be fascinating.  Everyone has different ears and it is great there are so many choices.  The only thing I can't understand is I receive hundreds of home listings from a local real estate agent and I have yet to see a pair of speakers sitting in a room.  People are willing to listen to the speakers on the TV, yet they have a $5,000 entertainment center the TV is sitting on.  If they only knew how sound imparts 80% of the experience.
At the risk of sounding like captain obvious, there's a less traveled option with increased mobility but it does have some sound quality limitations on your home hifi

Since you've already connected your iphone to your preamp, you're in essence using your iphone as the streamer

Look into the low cost USB attached DACs that will work with your iphone

I use the AudioQuest Dragonfly, $300 and it will achieve bit perfect playback

You can come out of the Dragonfly wired into headphones, your car stereo or your home  preamp

The headphone is handy for comparing and testing the different streaming file formats

It transformed the sound in my car.  I stream Tidal via cell service played through the Dragonfly that's attached AUX to the car stereo

Everyone thinks I got a new system in my car

Lots of little gymnastics to get to full MQA rendering and playback but pretty sweet once you connect all the dots

It took 6 months but the streaming convenience eventually pushed me over the edge to upgrade my primary home system

Primary drivers were the sound quality of the hi-res streaming formats and the convenience of changing out the music from a chair using a handheld device

I added a PS Audio DSD with the network bridge and cabled it to my internet router. Built a Roon server on a PC using an iphone as the content end point and user interface, subscribed to Tidal and QoBuz for content

I sit in my listening chair with 35 million songs at my fingertips using the  iphone to select content

Sound quality is exceptional, the convenience of changing content from the hand held device is fantastic and I haven't bought a CD or album since converting

The new releases come out on Tidal and QoBuz

Needless to say, I'm finally a streaming convert

Hope this helps