Any Comparisons between VTL 7.5 & ARC Ref 3

What about what I wrote is confusing??? Now I am confused...To be clearer for you, the comparison of these two preamps is imbalanced from the start. A more fair and equitable comparison would be the aforementioned 6.5 to the ARC, not the 7.5. The 6.5 is about 80% (according to VTL) of the 7.5, which is about what I attributed to the Ref3 in my auditions when comparing to the 7.5.

The 7.5 sounds light years better to my ear, and the 6.5 is on a more even footing to the Ref3.

There is nothing "imbalanced" about comparing two reference model preamps from different manufacturers, regardless of the price difference. If a higher price tag meant anything, then the VTL couldn't be compared to many more expensive preamps like the $36K Boulder and some others.

It's especially ironic that the preamp you feel doesn't measure up comes from the company with the longest history in the business and with preamps specifically. ARC/Bill Johnson virtually invented the concept of a high end dedicated preamp over thirty years ago.

It's a bit like saying that you shouldn't even discuss Rollins in the same breath as Coltrane because Coltrane is so vastly superior. Where ever you come down on these comparisons, there is a lot of subjectivity involved in picking the preamp that you consider to be the most musically rewarding. It's one thing to make your case for your favorite, but declaring the competition not worthy of comparison is a silly way to do it.

I was using the VTL7.5 Series 1. I gave very serious thought to sending in my unit for a Series 2 upgrade, hoping it would equal running my Modded Esoteric direct as I really wanted to keep a preamp in my system, but in the end, I decided not to waste another 3K as I am confident it would not have proved better than running the Esoteric direct to amps.

Frankg, yes, Alex created my CD Player. It’s a 2.5 version and I could not be more happy with it. I am going to hold out until the end of the year before I send him my UX-1 for an upgrade as I would bet that another refinement will come by years end.

About what I said regarding the Thor, I was not trying to make an “absolute statement” but I thought it was ironic that from day one, VTL told me not to bother with power conditioners and of course, I said to myself…what do they know :), and in the end of my experimenting, VTL’s advice was dead on accurate (for me). FWIW, the best power conditioner I used which got me closest (but not there) to running direct to the wall was a Reimyo ALS-777. That Reimyo Power Conditioner noticeably improved the Reimyo CD player but it did not work at all on my new modded Esoteric UX-1.

As far as comparing the REF3 and the 7.5, I think it’s a completely fair comparison. Let’s face it; most high end gear is good and usually very good. The Differences between component A and another manufactures component A are usually minimal at best. What sucks is going to a high end shop to listen to Component A and the set up of the shop is a complete joke, from speaker placement, to extreme room clutter, to components sitting on the carpet, and the list goes on forever. You got to get this stuff back to your home if you r really interested in how it sounds.

i have posted a comparison of the vtl tl 6.5 preamp in comparison to the arc ref 3. on this site, in reviews from members.

the vtl 7.5 was completely out of my pricepoint. i heard it at the dealer in the same set up as i heard the 6.5 at the dealer [my review is with my system at my home]

however, though i was advised that there would be perhaps only a subtle difference between the 6.5 and 7.6,in less than 20 seconds of listening [a/b 6.5 and 7.5] i noticed a difference in nuance and articulation and finesse. the 7.5 is impressive. sibelius,violin concerto,mutter.

the vtl 7.5 i heard was the latest version, series 2, not the orig 7.5. the series 2 version, which i heard for a short time and only one once work, was superb. cheers.

Davemitchell: I'm a little late about commenting on your post of 06-09-07 regarding the VTL and ARC preamps, but here goes. You say it's especially ironic that the preamp you feel doesn't measure up comes from the company with the longest history in the business and with preamps specifically. ARC/Bill Johnson virtually invented the concept of a high end dedicated preamp over thirty years ago. Not true, there is a company that maybe you have heard of called McIntosh Labs that got a 21 year head start (since 1949, Audio Research began in 1970). McIntosh's C-20 and C-22 preamps were considered edge of the art not to mention a dear gentleman named Saul Marantz who also built state of the art preamps. Not knocking Audio Research, but just setting the record straight and also McIntosh and Marantz did not have an update or new model change every few months or every few years, i.e., SPl, SP2, SP3, SP3A and so on up to LS26 and Ref l, 2, 3. No sour grapes here, just expressing an opinion.