Audio Physic Virgo II vs Avanti III

FWIW, one of the best systems I ever heard was a set up which had Avanti IIIs powered by Herron electronics (pre & amps). It was terrific in every way on classical AND rock - just killer. You didn't listen to the system - you just listened to natural "alive" music, whatever the genre.

If you like AP and have the space, I think the IIIs are still terrific speakers, I don't care what Mikey says. The price/performance ratio at their used price is a no brainer to me, provided you can give them the room they need. These speakers are worth mating to synergistic electronics - check out the Herron gear with them - it was a great combo.

Anybody have an idea why Gerhard abandoned the side-firing woofers? It's a great configuration and is really nice aesthetically too.
I think the Allegra is unattractive (the shape, not the finish shown in the photos), while the Allegretto looks nice but is a 2-way with only 1 mid/woof, a configuration that I usually find is lacking in clarity and dynamics compared with 2 mid/woofs.
I have the Virgo IIs and am anxious to hear this new line as well - one of the limitations of the Virgos is that they are not the last word in detail - maybe more modern drivers will address that shortcoming?

The Virgo IIs have great detail potential. They are room and placement sensitive...... With acoustic music, especialy Guitar, I have not heard a Speaker with more detailed presentation than the Virgo II. They are not the last word in detail or dynamics for Classical or Rock music.
Why did Gerhard abandon his side-firing woofers? Good question. You should email him and ask. The side-firing woofers were made necessary by his narrow baffle design. From what I've read, this is how the Audio Physic line become famous for their disapearing act.
Although I havn't seen them. I'm not gaga over the photos of any of the Sonic designs. I'm thinking of going down to Berkley, Ca. and checking them out sometime this summer.
I'm still looking for someone who has bi-amped Avanti IIIs with Pass Labs or any other SS gear.

I would not trade the Virgo's. We spend far too much time "upgrading" and in that search for that one minute of perfection, we tend to go in circles.

I am a Virgo owner and have similar tastes. I have a Pass X250 and have had great luck with it. I would just look at changing the preamp. Go with some tubed preamp. Possibly a Blue Circle, Copland, VACetc. My preference, the Blue Circle, but there are others. I don't think you will regret it and still save a lot of money.

There is some magic with the Virgo, that I have not been able to duplicate in 35 years of audio. I think Michael Fremer came across the same thing you and I have heard.

When you have a piece that appeals to you- why change?

I remember getting a word of advice from a reviewer (I won't mention his name) a few years ago when I bought his former reference CD player. I was supposedly trading down one or two levels and was down on myself at the time. I was not sure I would like it, missing detail, all the other goodies, we imagine we need more of.

He gave me some good advice and the magic behind this hobby.
It is not that we are looking at upgrading, but we are constantly looking for something different. In that search, we tend to make some purchases and sell some items that we regret later. So why not just stay with an item you like and just be content.

I have changed equipment less and am happier now than when I had a constant revolving door on the equipment. And yes, I ended up really liking the CD player he sold me even though it was " a step down".

If you really are caught up in the magic of the Virgo. Stay with it. I am. Who cares what other models are above it. While they are more expensive, might have better parts, more of everything,it still might be not what you are looking for and if you step back, you realize you already have what you are looking for. Virgo 11- if 6 years old, you have 20 years+ left. Those surrounds are not ones to disintegrate. If so, they can still be reconed and/ or replaced with the same drivers. The speaker on whole can not.

I have owned all three versions of Virgo's and found the III's are the best out of the group to my ears. They are much harder to set-up than the first two versions. Tubes seem to work better for my taste. Each version I have tried both with SS and tubes, the tubes always sound superior on the Virgo's. Can not comment on the Avanti III's, but looking forward to hearing the IV's. Just my experience as a long time owner of AP products.