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Devore or Harbeths to replace my ESL63s?

I'm on the last stages of a speaker quest that has been quite difficult. For the last year I've had ESL 63s in a smallish room (14'8 x 11'10). I've got them to work extremely well for small scale ensembles, particularly jazz, and they also sound great with electronic music. But I can't give them enough space to image an orchestra, and they don't really rock (at least without Gradient sub-woofers, but that's another story...)

So after a long search, it's come down to either Harbeth or Devore for replacements. These have been my favourite contemporary speakers for years, so basically I've just spent a long time finding out what I already knew.

I previously owned Compact 7ES3 and enjoyed them, but found them unrefined in the soprano regio, and slightly muddy around the port output. The Monitor 30.1 is considerably smoother in the high frequencies and I find it a beautifully balanced speaker. It is the perfect size for my room, with one failing. It lacks the half octave of bass needed to give kick drums any force. I tried the new SHL5+ in my room but they are just too big for my room, sadly.

A friend of mine owns some Devore Nines. Very few people have Devores in the UK, but he has a fantastic system with VTL 2.5/150. It used to be that when I heard his system I would find the Compact 7s unlistenable for a couple of days. That changed with the ESL63s, but the Quads have an uneven combination of great strengths and severe limits in a small room.

So it's come down to either Harbeth M30.1, Devore Super 8, or Devore 88.

I have a second hand pair of the Super 8s at home at the moment. They are beautifully organic and draw you in to their world gradually. Other speakers I have at home have more immediate and crisp micro-detail (Harbeth P3ESR for example), but the Super 8s seem to put a root into the ground and claim the room as the proper place for their music making. Relax, they say, don't worry about the details, we will sort out your musical life.

I have only two reservations; first, they are quite lean in the mid-bass, especially in comparison to my friend's Nines, and this presents some limits with rock and electronic. Second, my system is optimised for Harbeths (and then for ESLs), and Devores would probably work better with lower powered, very refined valve amps. I don't get the same clarity that I get with Harbeths in my system.

I also have an option on some second hand 88s, but I have never heard them and I would have to buy blind. That is generally against my religion.

I guess the key question is; do I go with what I know (Monitor 30.1) or look to optimise my system gradually for the newcomers (Devore Super 8 or 88).

I'd be grateful for any thoughts from anyone who has compared the M30.1 with Devores in the same room, since that is what I can't do at the moment.

(My system details: the amps are Unison Research Unico Pre/DM. The sources are a Fletcher Omega Point 5/Audio Note Arm/Nagaoka MP500, Trichord Diablo/NCPSU). Audio Synthesis DAX Discrete with AS modded CD Transport.)
andreweast
andreweast OP
30 posts
 
Ctsooner, you may be right about the Proacs - it would be for the room to make the decision. I'd certainly like to hear them at home but I'm in no rush because I'm enjoying the M30.1. The mid-bass emphasis seems to me very subtle indeed with these speakers, unlike the KEF Ref One that I mentioned, where it was a big warm bath. I would even contrast it to the P3ESR, which has a significant mid-bass hump to disguise the lack of any lower bass at all. This can be enjoyable, and because that speaker is not ported, it gets away with this emphasis - the extra bass isn't just port porridge.

Sorry for the excessive length and diaristic nature of my summary; I can't seem to find any editing functions or I would have cut it down to more relevant details about the M30.1.
ctsooner
2,480 posts
 
Enjoyed what you are posting Andre. No edit needed. Thanks for sharing. Are the Proac's fully burned in? I heard a pair of D40R's months ago as a store that also had AN/UK gear. We listened to all high end tube gear. I was floored at how good the Proac's sounded. They really did a great job with that ribbon. The bass wasn't up to par, but I think it was the amp as none of the speakers we heard that day had decent bass, so I don't think it was the Proac's.
andreweast OP
30 posts
 
That is a good question. It's actually quite possible that the D30R weren't fully burnt in since the dealer said they hadn't listened to them yet.

I certainly agree with you that they have achieved something special with the ribbon tweeter, and it didn't have any of the flaws I associated with that kind of deign. Dispersion was good, both lateral and vertical, and they didn't seem to have a narrow sweet spot. (Although of course, after a year with Quads, most speakers seem to have a wide sweet spot).

The D40R has twin bass drivers, so that might make the difference. I do seem to be finding that floor standing speakers with a single bass driver can achieve deep bass, but are often a little lean in the mid-bass. At least that is what I found with the Devore Super 8s, and I'm told the 88s are similar. But it may be that the D30R properly burnt in would loosen out in this area. I would get a home demo, but as it stands I'd prefer to spend money on a new phono stage when I'm enjoying the Harbeths. Perhaps in a few months time.
andreweast OP
30 posts
 
I came to update this thread and I cannot believe it has been more than a year since I started it. It's taken me that long to settle on speakers. 

The M30.1 were lovely, but I craved more bass, and a little more presence. A pair of SHL5 Plus came up for a good price so I went for them. They are wonderful, but I still had some issues in my small room. I had some plans drawn up for additional room treatment, but then, out of the blue, came something completely different. 
I had never heard of Vaughn speakers 3 months ago, and I suspect they are very rare in the UK, but a pair of Cabnernet Ones came up for an unbelievable price. They have the powered subs fitted, and this has really solved the issues with my small room. 

It's amazing such a speaker can work well in a room of 15' x 12'. There were times when I felt like giving up and moving to headphones, but now things have clicked. 

The speakers like a little room behind them for imaging but they work fine relatively close to the side walls with the active subs firing inwards. They have excellent dynamics and clarity, and they are chameleons with regards to amps. A friend brought a Unison Research SET amp around and they were so completely different to how they sound with my Croft amps. 

I am currently powering them with ARC LS26 and VAC Auricle Musicblocs, so it's suddenly becoming a surprisingly American system, after years of very British Quads and Harbeths. However I still have my Tom Fletcher deck and Audio Synthesis DAC so its a nice transatlantic synergy.
ctsooner
2,480 posts
 
Glad you are happy.  If you have a chance, check out the Vandersteen Treo or Quatro's.  I have the Treo's now and am selling them to get the Quatro's as I want that powered, room tunable bass, but the Treo's do have a ton of bass for a large room as long as you use the correct amp (folks really need to make sure their components all work well together to get the most out of their systems.  All too often you see mismatches and won't want to say anything as it may hurt someone's feelings).  Thanks for the update.
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