Do high dollar mono blocks truly improve the Sound Quality over the mid tier amps

@audioman58 The class D amps we make right now are exactly that and were from the start.

Atmosphere Why don’t you make a more powerful pair of monoblocks in Ganfets ?

100 watts , 200wpc in a larger room. With bigger 4 ohm speakers 

would give extra overhead which is always a good thing.especially since the THD is low  and they run cool.

@carlsbad2 Mono blocks also offer significantly more power if the stereo version of the amp shares the watts.  Love your system.  Hoping a "better" amp will move the needle.  I will report back.

Evaluate amp vs amp and ignore the mono-block vs traditional.  Sure Mono blocks can have some advantages, but many top amps are built as 2 monoblocks in traditional chasses.  Monoblocks increase the length of the signal cables while reducing the length of the speaker cables.  No consensus on which is better.

But a better amp will definitely sound better (truism?).  I much prefer class A.

@wspohn & @verdantaudio , thanks for these observations.  I'm also in the "warm" "musical" camp as I think most are.  I'd maybe describe it as neutral vs colored where "colored" is not a bad thing.  Measurements only tell one side of the story. I find colored amps are more enjoyable up to a point. 

I'll soon be able to answer my own question as I've decided to go for a pair of Momentum M400 MxV's.

I have heard those speakers a few times with Ayre Reference gear, D'Agastino gear and darTZeel or however their pattern of letters is supposed to be.  

For years I was "chasing the dragon" after hearing those with the Ayre gear as it is one of the most memorable listening experiences I have ever had and what drove me to design my own speakers and start Verdant.

The difficulty is that you could easily buy a pair of amps that you like less than the Classe or could find ones that blow them out of the water.  It is a matter of taste.  I am biased heavily toward musicality and staging rather than accuracy and measurement.  It is why I am biased heavily toward tube gear or very musical SS gear like AVM, Riviera and Audia Flight.  

What do you want more of?  What is missing?  Are there moments when you are disappointed and how? Answer these questions.  If you can't spot issues then maybe you just have an upgrade bug and this could and should be scratched elsewhere in your system.

I use a pair of bridged Classe DR3 VHC monos in one of my systems and feel that they still hold up very well to current amps.  I'd be inclined to stick with them if I were you - any improvement might be infinitesimal but at a far from infinitesimal cost.

I ran the Classes in my main system for awhile, driving Wilson Maxx 2s but found that I like a CJ Premier 11a just a tad better.

Atmashere when was the last   time  the class D mono blocks 

were Officially upgraded or improved ?  AGD for example has had 2-33 upgrades that are a noticeable step up  in sonics depending on model. 
there has been several new Gan Mosfets in the last 2 years  just an observation .

Atmosphere. When are you going to be coming out with a new even better model Gan Fet amplifier ?

@audioman58 What is meant by 'even better'?

Supposedly,  mono blocks have more umph to give as well as better separation and are  quieter.  I currently have both and I’d be hard pressed to tell the difference.   Each brand has their own strengths, but power has never been a problem.  Separation is harder to define, because all three of my amps are of different designs. The integrated is SS(Hegel H390), the Acoustats have SS inputs and tube outputs and the BHK 300’s are the exact opposite, tube inputs and SS outputs.

Atmosphere. When are you going to be coming out with a new even better model Gan Fet amplifier ?

@skinzy

If you want to go crazy, a pair of darTZeell NHB-468s is for sale here on Audiogon for a "mere" $129K.

Michael Fremer of Stereophile did a review, matching them with his Wilson Alexx and apparently loved them. His article also discusses various monoblocks he has paired with this speakers.

I still favor quad amping with 4 Classe Deltas before I did this, though.

The Class D's also offer a viable alternative as @audioman58 suggests.  Low energy consumption and light weight.features are very compelling. 

@skinzy Its not just low heat and light weight! Class D offers design criteria to the designer that also allow for some very nice distortion characteristics.

In case you are not aware of this fact, the difference you heard between amps when you upgraded was the difference in the distortion signature of those amps.

Class D offers a means to keep what distortion is made quite innocuous to the human ear. So if they are designed properly they can be very musical, erasing the advantages that class A or AB operation used to hold.

I also agree that quality DSP is a game changer.  My Weiss Helios has many ultra high quality DSP features that are extremely useful.

I agree dsp can tailor the sound to your liking.

With a focus on downsizing and having moved to Class D several years back, I have no practical interest in large heavy power guzzling amps anymore. That’s just me. To each their own. Especially when it comes to what look and sound happens to float one’s boat.

The other recent gamechanger for me is applying DSP for room correction, sound tweaking to personal preference, etc. I easily enjoy a lot of gear much more than I would be able to do otherwise were it not for DSP done well.

Practically, I am mostly off the equipment merry go round at this point. I still like trying new things, but it's now more because I just want to rather than that I need to.

Skinzy if anyone was a die hard class A, AB or tube amps 

my preconceptions were destroyed after hearing the AGD Class D- GAN Fet amps 

are the future they beat with relative ease anything at their price point and well above. Is it the best I have heard ,No. but you have to spend multitudes more.

my brothers Tenor Amplifiers ,no longer made  SS- tube  are 

classic greats when new $100k.  Just check the AGD out ,the Jeff Roland is very good also but much fancier case work ,and cannot say they are better.

@yyzsantabarbara Thanks for this insight.  My sense is your correct about sound signature of amps as others here have stated.  It seems there are two categories  in sound from the various manufacturers, the detailed airy amps vs the fuller punchier ones.  I'm thinking Constellation vs D'agostino. Plus one pays dearly for fancy casework. The Class D's also offer a viable alternative as @audioman58 suggests.  Low energy consumption and light weight.features are very compelling. 

Myself be8ng around a long time and hearing many brands on a regular basis ,being semi retired go to other audio clubs in other states 

a class D mono block that beats the big heavy amps  AGD between $8500 and 

my pick I would like to buy is their $11500 pair.  A Big mistake to overlook these GAN Fet  amplifiers. 

No advice on amps other than reviewing pre and sources as already mentioned- but your room and system look amazing!!!

Does the vaulted ceiling etc present any acoustic challenges and if so, is there a way to address them in an esthetically pleasing manor?

@skinzy Over at SoundStageNetwork.com | SoundStage.com - SoundStage! Home the former reviewer there, Jeff Fritz, wrote several articles about vintage amps and how good they sounded to him. It was in his series on his amp search, his current reference amp was a $25k-ish used Boulder amp, and I think it was a Theshold or Coda amp that he used temporarily that made him wonder about the very expensive amps he was always reaching for.

Saying all of that, my most expensive electronic piece is my amp. I also hope to buy another brand-new amp for 2x the price of the used amp. It is not better than what I have but it sounds different. Variety.

BTW - I always like Classe amps.

@skinzy 

Apologies, I meant the McIntosh MC901.

The model I referenced would probably be a step down from your Deltas.

And yes, you will get great hate on these forums for liking such a plebeian product, despite it costing six figures each.

I recently upgraded from JC1 monos to a CH Precision M1.1. The differences are shocking, as they should be for the price difference. :)

what was the shocking difference you heard? could you put it in words?

20k --> 100k --> 5x needle movement?

$20k --> $60k (M1.1 in stereo is not $100k) 

3X the performance, difficult to quantify but absolutely worth the $ IMO.

Top to bottom it's just much more transparent, more detail, more precision/focus.  Soundstage has more depth, all the stuff I had hoped for it delivered.  

@skinzy 

Your points are well taken but how can anyone tell you if a higher priced amp will "move the needle" if you are not specific about the replacement in question and the only specification that seems to matter is the cost? Yes, higher priced amps should produce better SQ, but this will not always be the case. And even if I had the history of personally comparing some pricier amps with your Classe's, my opinion should only be a guideline; it's only your opinion that matters. Best of luck.

Unfortunately, no one in this thread has responded to my question directly based on direct personal experience with an upgrade.

@skinzy I did. Apparently you didn't consider my answer valid, even though it was based on exactly what you asked about. I gave you an accurate answer; in case it was not obvious it can be boiled down to this: 'It depends.'

I gave the reasons why. Put another way, going up the line may or may not be an improvement; its entirely possible that something far less expensive might sound better.

I can go into the technical reasons why this is so if you are interested.

I recently upgraded from JC1 monos to a CH Precision M1.1. The differences are shocking, as they should be for the price difference. :)

what was the shocking difference you heard? could you put it in words?

20k --> 100k --> 5x needle movement?

I recently upgraded from JC1 monos to a CH Precision M1.1.  The differences are shocking, as they should be for the price difference.  :)

I suspect your system will improve greatly with the right amp.

On your specific Amp question, if tubes are acceptable I’d strongly recommend a CJ Stereo Art150. I’ve been using one for the past year with my Wilson Sasha DAW’s. Beautiful, full range amp and a great paring. This was a major upgrade from CJ Premier 12 monoblocks for me.

I’ve heard Wilsons with tubes and SS (A-B testing) and tubes win hands down IMHO. No tubey haze here either. This amp is clear, full, detailed.

It was nice going to a single box from monoblocks for space management. And finally, put it on a Symposium Ultra platform if you do get one to get the best sound from it.

Good luck!

@skinzy 

”Unfortunately, no one in this thread has responded to my question directly based on direct personal experience with an upgrade”

I’ve learned a lot of the various audio forums, but unlike most of my hobbies I have to say audio forums have  than their share of people who just like to talk and more seriously unfriendly people.  (Not talking about anyone on the thread; just a general comment.)

Back to your question, I would probably reach out to Wilson or your dealer and see what they think about different monoblocks.  The 800D3s have a weird dip (or requirement or something; I have forgotten ) that the Deltas can specifically address.  All speakers will have their quirks, no matter how nice.  You might want to see if there is a particular set of monoblocks that cures  that issue, whatever it is.

My gut tells me you’re not going to do much better than two Deltas, unless it’s four Deltas in a bi-amp set up.

(One other intriguing possibility would be the McIntosh hybrid drive amps.  McIntosh gets a bad rap in audio forums due to being too “common” for a lot of folks — and overpriced in some models.)

But I’m intrigued by the Mcintosh mc451 dual mono amplifier, that has tubes on top and solid state below. From the ad copy “The MC451 Dual Mono Amplifier is a high-end, hybrid amplifier designed for bi-amping loudspeakers. It combines a 150 Watt vacuum tube amplifier and a 300 Watt solid-state amplifier on a single chassis, utilizing McIntosh’s proprietary Hybrid Drive technology.”

Note, I’ve never heard or even seen one of these.  So it’s not  recommendation, just spitballing.

@aewarren If you would read my OP you would see this " I'd love to hear from folks who have made this move in their systems or heard comparisons at shows or dealers."  I am asking about OTHER PEOPLES experience with a power amp upgrade.  Moreover I'm NOT asking for a critique of my current gear or listening room.

Since you have a difficult WAF restricted room, the only thing that could produce significant movement of the needle sonically would be a consultation with a professional acoustician like PoesAcoustics (Matt Poes) or Anthony Grimani (Grimani systems) who have a knack for measurements and discrete non-invasive treatments (made to look like a regular wall/ceiling, room decor, etc), probably a discrete in-wall sub, tuned resonator at a feasible spot, etc.

(Beyond the scope of a forum thread).

Actually...talk to Anthony on this one, if you can catch him (if he ain’t too busy).

l love the Boulder Preamp idea ... or others on that strata!

Some good advice here, some questionable. The truth is there is only one person who can answer your question and that person is you. If you bought your Classe amps from a local dealer, you should try to talk him into a home demo of the amps in which you are interested. If that is not an option, you would be buying with blindness and hope. As others have stated, you have a very nice system in a room full of glass and highly reflective surfaces. I don’t see any treatments (blinds, drapes etc.) on the large front windows and this could be a WAF issue, but covering those might be of more benefit that changing amps. Otherwise, try to do what we’re all unsuccessful at - enjoying what you already have.

Edibles would be a more direct investment in sound quality. 

I looked at the picture of your room and I see a lot of glass there I don't know if it's covered with heavy drapes or blinds but if it isn't you'll be getting a lot of bouncing off the glass which will screw up your sound.

In a word, no. More expensive amps are often because they use more "interesting" case designs or more colorful shiny bits. 

@davetheoilguy Thanks for talking about the question I asked and not talking about room acoustics which I did not ask about.  As I said in the OP I love the sound of the Delta amps.  I actually moved from their older model the CT-M600.  When I inserted the Delta's I had an immediate and significant positive improvement in SQ.  That's why I have wondered if there are further improvements to be had. Unfortunately, no one in this thread has responded to my question directly based on direct personal experience with an upgrade.

I upgraded my PS Audio M700 monos to the M1200s. Wider sound stage with more air. Nice improvement.

The Classe Deltas are not mid-tier.  If anything, they are a bargain compared to

lesser amps that cost more.   B&W frequently pairs their best equipment with the Delta monos — because, according to a Bowers rep Intalked to, they were designed to work together.  I sold more expensive amps to get the Classe because I had Bowers 800D3 with which I was very pleased.  The Deltas were a noticeable upgrade.

The only concern I might have is if the Deltas are a good fit with your Wilsons.  I would suspect so, as they have great ability to push out power, but I don’t know.

It's certainly possible, but it will depend on the specific monoblocks.  If the monoblocks are from Convergent Audio, the answer is almost certainly, but everything else also matters.  

With as nice a system as you already have, it might make sense to look for alternatives that can be swapped in once in a while for a change of pace, rather than replacements.  Yes, there are amplifiers that might suit your taste and system more than what you already have, but, that can only be determined by a trial; I don't think anyone can make a specific suggestion that would necessarily be an improvement.  Someone mentioned Soulution; yes I think their amps sound good, but will you agree?  I think Gryphon sounds good too.

But rather than going the same high powered solid state route, perhaps you can get alternatives that you can use when you get the inch for something different?  i personally don't like most high powered tube amps, but, what about something medium powered from the tube world? I like the Synthesis Roma 98DC Special Edition at 40 wpc.  If you think you need more power, their NYC100, 175 or 200 models are very good for higher powered tube amps.  They also have terrific integrated amps like the A40 and A100 that I think are super bargains and would make nice alternatives (not necessarily replacements).  My local dealer has sold Synthesis amps to several owners of Wilson speakers who were shocked at how much better these lower-powered amps sounded than the D'Agostino, Mcintosh, Diavalet, etc. amps that were in the system.  Many bought the Synthesis amp for their bedroom system, but when they tried it in their main system, that was a surprise.

Beautiful room. The dimensions are pretty ideal. The glass walls and lack of acoustic treatments make my ears hurt. As mentioned earlier, you would be better off spending your money on improving the room acoustics before buying any new equipment. 

@OP Replacing your XP-27 with an XP-32 would probably be a better value improvement.

You have some very nice equipment. What do you feel is lacking in the sound it makes? Perhaps room treatment is the direction you should go at this point?

The OP is asking if higher end monos "could" be a significant sonic upgrade.

IMO absolutely yes is the only answer, but the real question is how much is the OP prepared to spend, because price is MORE OFTEN THAN NOT an indication of ultimate quality.

Example: the difference in sonic quality and price between the Deltas and the new 7 series from Soulution is vast.

One way to be sure of the pairing is to ask Wilson which amps they use when they display/demo at Munich and/or Axpona. They'd know better than anyone here how to get synergy with their speakers.

I see "zero" acoustic treatment in a room which appears to be very lively with lots of hard, reflective surfaces. You may not even know how good your system can sound presently. I'd suggest starting there before spending another penny on equipment.

Re original query:  In general, yes.  Price will vary by intent or depth of pockets...