Jeff Rowland

Schacter,

Please describe the differences you hear between the 525 and Continuum S2...is there a night and day difference?

I have the Continuum S2. I had the Spectron many years ago. I guess I should update my system as it is now completely different.

Schacter,

Thanks for the feedback, although I feel my 525 could be better with musical nuance/detail and I'm actually happy with the dynamics. Do you still have the Continuum S2 or do you have the Spectron Musician? If you have the Spectron, how does it compare to the Continuum S2. Thanks!

I had a JR 525 in my system briefly, replacing a monster McCormack DNA-500. I paired it with a Modwright-LS 36.5 preamp. It sounded pleasant enough but I felt it was lacking in dynamics, presence and oomph. I then bought a used JR Continuum S2 here on A'gon and used that in place of the 525/MW and McCormack/MW combos. Much, much better. I sold the 525, McCormack and Modwright -- all great units, but the Continuum sounded at least as good as the McCormack-MW combo and I thought it was appreciably better than the 525-MW combo.

That's what I figured, but I just wanted to make sure you didn't take offence to any of my comments.

Zd542,
I know your not bashing...my point is that I "try" to evaluate components in my system. I continue to say, "there are no absolutes in audio only preferences."

Ricred1,

I believe every word you are saying. I just used my Rowland as an example of how things can go wrong when you least expect it. If you chose your Rowland because you liked it best, then you made the right choice. I still keep my Rowland, even though its not currently being used, because it does do things that no other amp I've heard at any price, or design does. Equipment matching is not bashing. Sometimes good components don't work well together.

Zd542,
My JR 525 replaced a Parasound A21. Prior to purchasing the 525, I had in my system, a Bryston 4bsst2, Ayre integrated, and a JR 125. To my ears and in my system the, with the exception of the bass, the Jeff Rowland 125 was the most musical. I decided to get the 525 based on my evaluation of the JR 125.

"Yes, it's a system, but each component can impact the overall signature of the sound. "

True, but I'm not sure if you understood the point I was trying to make. Each component does impact the overall signature of the sound. However, you can put a component in the system that takes away from the others. Going back to my Rowland example, when I put it in the system, it doesn't allow the other components to do things they normally do.

I believe he is referring to the Model 112. I currently use this amp and get great soundstage depth and imaging definition. Not every component will work in every system.

Zd542,
I've owned several amps and listened to several in different systems over the years(Parasound, Bryston, Peachtree, Bel Labs, Classe, Levinson). To my ears Jeff Rowland is one of the few amps that produces a 3d image and I'm very satisfied with the 525, especially for how much it cost.

"At this level, its not good enough to just pick components. In order to get what you are looking for in the above quote, you must consider at the whole system. One mismatched piece can ruin the systems ability to image properly." Okay, but in an earlier post you say "I'll start off with 2 recommendations. For solid state, I would look at an Ayre K-5, and for tubes, an Aesthetix Calypso. Those 2 pieces do everything right, and work well with a wide variety of components. Either should go very well with your Rowland."
My experience tells me that switching one component or cable for that matter can have a significant impact on the sound. Yes, it's a system, but each component can impact the overall signature of the sound. I'm looking for suggestions, but I'll let my ears and wallet decide.

Zd542, would you please share with us what model Rowland amp you are referring to? I'm interested since I've heard many of them and your experience runs counter to mine. TIA

"I want better separation between instruments and better front to back placement of instruments.How to get there(what's my weakest link) and how much it's going to cost is the question? It may be time to investigate replacing my Aerial 7Ts!"

At this level, its not good enough to just pick components. In order to get what you are looking for in the above quote, you must consider at the whole system. One mismatched piece can ruin the systems ability to image properly.

Just to give a real example of what I mean, my system consists of speakers and electronics that excel at imaging, scale, soundstage, etc.. I have this one Jeff Rowland amp, and it doesn't matter what system I put it in. With the Rowland, the imaging goes from 3d to 2d. Its just a good example of why you can't take anything for granted when putting together a high end system. Most people would assume an expensive amp like that would automatically work with no problems.

Onhwy61,
I'm looking into speakers now. A few on my list are Joseph Audio Perspectives and Dynaudio C2s.

I didn't mean to suggest that you didn't have a vision, but that simply that you hadn't stated it. How to achieve your goals is a very different question than what you asked. It's not guaranteed, but everything you want may be had by different loudspeaker/listener positioning.

Onhwy61,
I have a clearly defined vision. I want better separation between instruments and better front to back placement of instruments.How to get there(what's my weakest link) and how much it's going to cost is the question? It may be time to investigate replacing my Aerial 7Ts!

"The Bricasti M1 sounds much better direct than the DSD."

That's your reference, so whatever you do, you'll need to compare it so you don't make a backwards move. A preamp is a very personal choice. So whatever is recommended, by me or anyone else, needs to be followed up with a demo. I really can't stress that enough. A preamp is the one component you really can't afford to mess up. Also consider that you have good sound now, going direct with your dac. When you already have good sound, its much easier to make a mistake than an improvement.

I'll start off with 2 recommendations. For solid state, I would look at an Ayre K-5, and for tubes, an Aesthetix Calypso. Those 2 pieces do everything right, and work well with a wide variety of components. Either should go very well with your Rowland.

Forward to what? Your system is at a point where you need a clearly defined vision of what you are trying to accomplish. What is that vision?

I don't know if I need a preamp. I'm looking for the next step forward.

Why do you think you need a preamp?

Zd542,

Any suggestions on preamps I should listen to? I had a Parasound JC2 BP and to my ears it degraded the sound when compared to the PS Audio DSD I had at the time. The Bricasti M1 sounds much better direct than the DSD.

Zd542 is correct, you need to add a suitable quality preamp to improve the sound of running your M1 DAC direct to your amp. Many preamps will actually degrade the sound, so you would be best off if you could audition the exact preamp you're considering in your system before committing to purchase it. Hopefully that is an option available to you.

"I just added a pair of SVS SB 13 Ultra subs and was wondering if adding a preamp would provide better results"

Yes, but you have to get the right preamp.

Bill_k,
Thanks for the response. There is no doubt in my mind that the 625 mk2 will be a significant upgrade, but for now it's more than I can spend. I'm currently using a Bricasti M1 direct to the 525. I just added a pair of SVS SB 13 Ultra subs and was wondering if adding a preamp would provide better results...that's why I ask is adding a Capri 2 preamp or getting the Continuum S2 Integrated the best option? I'm biased also and will stay with Jeff Rowland amps. I really love the JR sound.

I think that their suggestion is a good one. I have compared the 525 and 625, and the 625 is clearly a step up in performance. It's more refined overall with improved body, depth and dynamics. The 625 has a more effortless presentation when compared to the 525. Of course that improvement comes with a commensurate increase in price.

I should note that I currently own the 625, so my opinion may be biased accordingly. I'm always looking for another upgrade (sound familiar?), but am having trouble finding something significantly better than the 625 without almost doubling its price. There is no end to the madness of this hobby!

I called Rowland and they suggested going from my 525 to the
625, which is out of my price range. I'm curious if anyone
on Audiogon has done a direct comparison between the 525
with the Capri 2 preamp and the Continuum S2 Integrated amp?

Preamp is the same. Power amp modules are what you want to investigate. The Continuum S2 has a Pascal power unit. No idea about 525. Why not call Rowland to inquire.