Paypal...buyer protection fees didnt help me

   I had a previous post about buying with PayPal so i'm piggybacking off that one.I found an integrated amp on U.S.A.M. for a decent price,the seller wanted me to pay PayPal / friends and family but because it was over 6k I went ahead and pay the fees (approx $200.00 and change) thinking it was worth the extra money  for buyer protection.The shipping was $300 from the east coast to the mid west and took 6 days i believe.The crate was over 100 pounds,it came on Monday and it took me until Sunday to get a buddy to help me get it up a flight of stairs,out of the crate and on a dedicated stand..i'm in my 60s and retired.The amp had distortion on one channel,we both heard it,I swapped cables on speakers and same result coming now on the opposite side...but to make sure before I started screaming the sky is falling I borrowed other gear and went through the testing...this all took another week....After i did my due diligence I contacted the seller and told him i wanted my money back which fell on deaf ears so i filed a case with PayPal...I was told by PP that i needed get verification of my complaint in writing from a legit source and submit this info within 10 days.I called 2 audio stores in the mid-west and was told that they did'nt have nor could they verify on gear they don't sell.  I needed to send it to manufacture who's on the west coast,so i called the manufacture..approx 7 days to get it to them at a cost of a few hundred in shipping ,the down time could be anywhere from a few days to weeks depending on back log..and then cost and time to get it back not repaired as i'm just looking for them to tell me its messed up in writing for these clowns at PP..I called PP and told them the 7 to 10 days i was given to get this all done was insane,forgetting the cost involved..I mean it took me a week to get it upstairs and unpacked with help......So I was denied my claim and will have to deal with getting this going again.I informed PayPal that i will never pay their fees again because the buyer protection i thought i had did'nt really exist,the burden of proof was on my shoulders to show them that what i got which was described as mint was'nt...Maybe its their new policy because the company's stocks are in the crap hole and the share holders need paid,who knows but they wont get my money again.I think ill buy new from a USA dealer........


  If waiting 14 days to file with PP makes me suspect then so be it but i find it rather ridiculous to suggest that. I could have filed that Sunday when we first hooked it up.I wanted to give the seller and the amp its due diligence before screaming which is what I did.Keep in mind what PP requested was'nt simply getting some self employed guy  working in his garage to look at it,they requested a detailed printed form from an authorized repair facility..and im in no where mid west,I dont even have a movie theater in my town.The 2 facilities within several driving hours of me both said no.It wasnt as simple as putting a stamp on the crate and dropping it in the mail box..It had to go 2200 miles one way,inspected and returned all within a week.As a long time power seller on Ebay I know they give buyers minimum 30 days to return anything for any reason.It was'nt buyers remorse with me,the amp has an issue and i paid for that protection if some thing was wrong reguardless if it was dropped,kicked,punted in shipping,the reason is really irrelevant to me.I paid for a "described as mint unit" with hard earned funds.I paid for that buyer protection and PP didnt not cover me ..Ill get the unit going again and hopefully enjoy what I hear but i will say this....My used gear buying days are about over with.thanks

Well, we're all on your side, all sounds reasonable to us. But paypal and/or person you purchased from not us. Your entire story could just be a story as far as they know. I'd be just like Carlsbad if someone waited 14 days to tell me something I sold suddenly wasn't working correctly. I'd assume  component was operating correctly upon receipt, something went wrong in those intervening days, operator error or ? Now, they may relate a story such as yours, hard to say if I'd believe or not, telephone conversation would help in this determination.


The thing is we don't know if seller knew beforehand or damage occurred in transit? Another good reason to develop personal dialogue with person doing transaction with, many won't conduct transaction without prior telephone conversation.

@missioncoonery , this is right on the Paypal site:


You also have the option of self filing in small claims. Usually just the threat is enough. You also have the ability to file a claim against Paypal itself.


This is the wording in their agreement,

Step 3: Respond to PayPal’s requests for documentation or other information, after you, the seller or PayPal escalates your dispute to a claim for reimbursement. PayPal may require you to provide receipts, third party evaluations, police reports or other documents that PayPal specifies. You must respond to these requests in a timely manner as requested in our correspondence with you.


As we are still working in an economy severely affected by the pandemic, what the court considers as a "timely matter" is likely to be much different from what Paypal tries to enforce on you. As they have not put explicit time limits in advance that I can tell, then you will have a case based solely on this.


They also define 3rd party evaluations. An authorized repair facility is a 3rd party w.r.t. you and the seller, but I think, again given the force majeur of a pandemic, that the court may also see insisting on specific 3rd parties and not someone simply skilled and qualified, as unjustifiably limiting. Again, as they have not defined that well in advance, it works to your favor in court.


As noted, there is still the credit card to fall back on if too late. This often comes down to being the squeaky wheel. At a start, I would still see if there is a kind repair technician or engineer somewhere near you who can take a basic measurement. This will help you with your credit card filing, and if you file small claims.


For all those complaining that you took too long to file, I will remind them that by the Paypal agreement you have 180 days.





He didn't take too long to file by the book, the delay only brings other possible issues into play.


I'd also continue to pursue a better outcome, a local tech would have been my first choice right from beginning. But then this wouldn't be priority item with already swamped tech, likely no luck here. I'd go back to manufacturer, perhaps their tech could say how damaged occurred, just don't think paypal will take buyers word over sellers word in this particular case. Sure seller claiming unit functioning correctly when shipped, makes shipper libel, good luck with that!

Personally I think it's all about money/ PP profit in this transaction.Their stock is  down what 30%. the last time I checked.If  this was a $100 .00 transaction there would not be any of this jumping through hoops.Who cares at 4 bucks fee...but I paid over 200.00 in buyer protection fees..Hard to give that back when your company is floundering.