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The Miller Carbon Story

Had a real nice conversation this morning with Origin Live’s Mark Baker. Mark makes some of the very best turntables on the planet and I was interested to learn more. This was our first conversation and so he was interested in me as well. This reminded me of others who have asked.   

The following story is only superficially about the Miller Carbon. The larger and I would say more important subtext is you can do it too! Please dear reader note the number of times something was tried not knowing whether or not it would work. Like all things in life: The more things you try and the more effort you put into it the better you get at it.


The Miller Carbon Story

My first turntable was a Technics SL-1700 with Stanton 681-EEE. It was 1976. Still have that turntable, anyone can see it, right there on my system page.  https://systems.audiogon.com/systems/8367. Rack on the right. Bottom shelf.  

Next, after college, came the Listening Room and with it a new turntable. This was way before the internet. All we had was Stereophile On Dead Tree. After reading all the reviews it came down to a VPI package or Basis/Graham. What to do? Cast your mind back, way back, to the primitive past. I faxed my question to Stereophile.  

Michael Fremer called me back!   

The Basis/Graham was my own decision. Fremer didn’t talk me into anything. Quite the opposite. He was a source of much useful information that helped me make up my own mind. So it was that I learned early on from Michael Fremer what it is that a reviewer really is supposed to do: provide the reader with the information they need to make their own informed decision.  

My first high end mod was to remove the cheap rubber power cord from the Basis motor and replace it with an inexpensive power cord. Cheap, but proven to be better than all the freebie PCs and I wanted to find out if it made any difference on a turntable motor.  

It did! Same exact improvements heard on the other components it had been tried on before. How or why, who knows, but I heard it. Other mods followed. Different belt materials were used. Silk, cotton, floss. Each had its own influence on the sound. Fascinating!  

This was all part of the process of investigating turntable performance in order to upgrade. Easy to read about different materials, mass, motors, bearings- but what does it all mean in the real world? This was my way of figuring it out for myself.  

Teres Audio seemed to be the value leader. A complete turntable was too expensive, but the motor could be added to the Basis with only a slight modification for the speed sensor. When this worked out extremely well it gave me the confidence to go for the platter and bearing.  

But what about the plinth? Around this time I was working with DJ Casser and his Black Diamond Racing Shelf. His Shelf material was so much more effective than acrylic, it had to make a better plinth too. After a good deal more planning a BDR Source Shelf was cut into a unique sort of egg shape. Another piece was cut 4” diameter, drilled and tapped to be used as the nut to hold the bearing. Two more pieces about 3 inches in diameter were cut and stacked to make the tone arm mount. Three Round Things with Cones were screwed into the bottom of the plinth. The Miller Carbon was born. http://www.teresaudio.com/fame/40.html



128x128millercarbon
millercarbon's avatar
millercarbon OP
12,531 posts
 
They may find that perplexing but to me it is understandable and indeed a major reason in choosing Origin Live. That was really the over-arching theme or reason for this whole discussion, to try and relate some of what was learned in order to better understand what can be.

The other main point, maybe even more important, is to encourage people to actually try and do some of this stuff. Because it is one thing to talk and think, but really we learn by doing. Without doing, anyone can talk themselves into anything. See it all the time. Narrative is the scourge of our times.

Doing produces results that cannot be denied. When your Sovereign is silent, well that is just a fact anyone can hear. It should be plain as day the turntable and arm have no way of knowing what to silence and what to pass as music. So if you hear silence from one table and not another you can be sure, absolutely certain, which one is doing it right.

The real reason then they are perplexed is they bought into a false narrative. We will know soon enough. The Sovereign is in LA customs. We will know soon enough.
chakster's avatar
chakster
6,144 posts
 
I'm sorry, but how many people can say this turntable is beautiful ? I'm just curious. This taste in high-end just killing me. With all my respect I can't say it's beautiful, quite opposite. So many years of tweaking just to have this in the system ? Even if the sound is amazing I would like to stay miles away from such turntables. 
dustyb13
17 posts
 
Off topic.  When did you work with DJ Casser?  I've been trying to find a friend that worked with him as well.DB13
millercarbon's avatar
millercarbon OP
12,531 posts
 
Late 1990’s. I was trying different things and his stuff was so good I had to call and guess my enthusiasm made up for not having an actual business and so he let me be his distributor in Seattle. Which really amounted to showing off to the guys at the local audio club, taking them around to try in their systems.

I was young, it was fun. Didn’t pay anything, certainly not enough to cover all my time visiting all these guys. How many people make house calls to demo $60 worth of Cones? 😂 But it was cool, I got to see a lot of systems, learned a lot, massive experience.

So working with him was all over the phone, and working with his products. He sent me some stuff nobody else got, which is how I learned it isn’t really the carbon fiber, that is almost entirely cosmetic and makes for a nice story. When I say over and over again how the "reasons" manufacturers state for performance are best regarded as nothing but stories, it comes from experience. Lots of experience. Not just DJ. Lots of em. All the same. Stories.

Audiophiles take the stories so seriously. Psych!

Back then I had a lot less experience and confidence. The idea for the Miller Carbon turntable came from using the Basis and realizing it was nothing more than a board with some holes in it. If the Basis could be that good with acrylic, which is nowhere near as good as BDR, think what it could be made out of BDR!

Being young, naive, and trusting, I discussed my ideas with DJ. Couldn’t get him to make me one. Finally decided to just build my own from a BDR Source Shelf.

That was the beginning of the end of my working with DJ Casser. First he started telling me his material was too hard, couldn’t possibly be cut except with special tools. Then even if I did the dust would kill me. When I say manufacturers exaggerate, here we go. Cuts up just fine with band saw, table saw, router, you name it. Sands out real nice too. Just look at it. Anyone but chakster can see how beautiful it is.

The end of working with DJ came at CES. I was in the Talon room with my prototype turntable on display. A friend came in said, "Hey have you seen the BDR room? DJ ripped off your turntable!" Went there and sure enough, everything I had told him that he had pretended no interest in doing, he had stolen and built into a real impressive looking table!

So that was my experience working with DJ Casser.
pengun
79 posts
 
Acquire and read "A Vibration Measuring Machine" by Roy Gandy and the gang at Rega. Then you may have a chance.

Plinths are evil. ;)
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