Who tried Class D only to return to S/S or Tube



And what were the reason you did a backflip back to S/S or tube.
As there are a few pro Class D threads being hammered at the moment, I thought I'd put this up, to get some perspective.

Cheers George
128x128georgehifi

Hi George, what would you deem to be a sonically safe switching frequency for future class D modules?


Do you know of any such "Upcoming Attractions" with higher switching rates preparing their entry to market?


Meantime, Yesterday I checked the NCore NC1200 switching frequencies... It ranges from 440Khz to 520Khz., which is almost 5 octaves above theoretical human hearing range.


Honestly, I cannot perceive any artifacts or shortcomings from my amps... But there may be some audible artifacts that I am not aware of. 


On the other hand, I freely admit that I would be just as happy with a wonderful Solution monoblock, or a major AudioResearch tubed amp... I mean, apart from the heat dissipation, and reliability anxieties from ARC amps.


PS... My class D monos are not light... 160 Lbs per side. They are not furnaces by any means, but are relatively toasty to the touch during Austin summertimes.


Saluti, G.




The switching frequency guidocorona, may be 520khz, but it’s the amplitude as well of it not just the frequency and has to be filtered at the end with all that rms power by low order filters that have to take that power. 

From what I’ve been told by those in the know of Class D technology this has to be shifted up 5 to 10 times higher so the filtering of it on the output of a Class D amp can then also be shifted up higher, and therefore not be affecting the audio band, with audio band HF phase shifts or audio band HF roll-offs.

On most of todays Class D amps that try to get the highest frequency response they can get, you may hear a sizzle from a high bandwidth tweeter if you put your ear to it, if it’s not muted eg: in-between tracks on a cd.

Then there are those Class D’s that want to get rid of that sizzle which filter it even more savagely, then those ones can be starting to roll off the audio HF already at 5khz.

The sounds of the two can be then different in the upper-mids and highs, one being hard or harsh because it lets through some of the switching noise. The other sounding opaque or soft in the upper mids and highs.

Therefore to cure one or the other the switching frequency needs to be much higher so the filtering has little or no effect within the audio band.

Analogy: is to remember the early days of cdp’s with their brick wall filters, which on paper looked ok but sounded shocking, just because they wanted to show a flat 20hz-20khz frequency response. But in Class D amps this filtering is low order and happens at the end of the power amp at full rms wattage power levels, and the filters need to take all that power handling.

Then there's the SMP power supplies another problem again, that some Class D manufactures try to get around by powering with more expensive to make Linear power supplies.  


Cheers George  

I’m  a little puzzled by all this "switching" talk.  My class D amp has 60kHz bandwidth while tweeters are almost completely quiet with my ear next to them (200W amp).   I’ve read the same in many reviews of different class D amps.  It was much worse with class AB amp in the same setup.   Highs in my amp are very clean while midrange is simply wonderful.   As for SMPS being noisy, nothing can be further from the truth.  New zero current/zero voltage switching SMPS are extremely quiet and that’s why Jeff Rowland uses them not only in class AB amps but also in preamps purely for their low noise (efficiency is unimportant in preamps).  Just to show an example:  Benchmark reduced noise floor in their latest DAC by 10dB using SMPS instead of Linear PS used in previous model of the same DAC.  It is because Linear PS is not linear at all.  It is simply unregulated noisy switcher that switches at 120Hz at max voltage producing not only hard to filter 120Hz but whole bunch of high frequency harmonics - since current is taken from the mains in huge narrow spikes.  Power supply is line and load unregulated and requires huge amount of capacitors to keep voltage steady.  These high inductance capacitors are in series with the output (circuit closes thru them).  Adding parallel non inductive caps might help but it will also create (with inductance of electrolytic caps) a parallel resonance circuit that will ring.   That’s why class D amps with SMPS are praised in  many reviews for keeping composure under heavy peaks (orchestra’s forte).  Lets forget about "switching" - speakers are unable to play 400kHz while we are unable to hear it at all.  It is imagined problem by "experts" that have absolutely no clue trying to find something wrong. Class D are linear amps where duty cycle, instead of voltage, is used as adjusted quantity.  

Thank you George, yes I have heard the screaches you describe, as well as the dark uninvolving sound several times at RMAF.... Quite consistently from some class D brands, and unfortunately equally consistently from some brands that produce otherwise well regarded class A, A/B, and a variety of OTLs and other tubed amps 


Luckily none of the amps of any class that I have owned since I sold an Aragon 4004 Mk.2 in the late '90s have had an even remote propensity of creating such audible horrors.


Somehow, my home is blessed by marvellous music... Yes, I hear music that is congruent with the sound of live acoustic instruments that I have experienced since I was six years old.


Can it be enhanced further? ... Of course!



Can it be enhanced further?

Yes it can and soon I think, and I'll be there when it does, as soon as I see the technology about to become available from the big multinational component manufacturers, to supply the Class D manufacturers with. 

I'll get the jump and flick my expensive power hungry potential boat anchors before it's too late, and wait for the 2nd generation Class D to appear, even if it means I'm without music for a while.


Cheers George