The gulf between the level of substance and knowledge Amir is bringing to this conversation vs some of the empty sniping from the sidelines is fairly startling to behold.
Why HiFi Gear Measurements Are Misleading (yes ASR talking to you…)
About 25 years ago I was inside a large room with an A-frame ceiling and large skylights, during the Perseid Meteor Shower that happens every August. This one time was like no other, for two reasons: 1) There were large, red, fragmenting streaks multiple times a minute with illuminated smoke trails, and 2) I could hear them.
Yes, each meteor produced a sizzling sound, like the sound of a frying pan.
Amazed, I Googled this phenomena and found that many people reported hearing this same sizzling sound associated with meteors streaking across the sky. In response, scientists and astrophysicists said it was all in our heads. That, it was totally impossible. Why? Because of the distance between the meteor and the observer. Physics does not allow sound to travel fast enough to hear the sound at the same time that the meteor streaks across the sky. Case closed.
ASR would have agreed with this sound reasoning based in elementary science.
Fast forward a few decades. The scientists were wrong. Turns out, the sound was caused by radiation emitted by the meteors, traveling at the speed of light, and interacting with metallic objects near the observer, even if the observer is indoors. Producing a sizzling sound. This was actually recorded audibly by researchers along with the recording of the radiation. You can look this up easily and listen to the recordings.
Takeaway - trust your senses! Science doesn’t always measure the right things, in the right ways, to fully explain what we are sensing. Therefore your sensory input comes first. You can try to figure out the science later.
I’m not trying to start an argument or make people upset. Just sharing an experience that reinforces my personal way of thinking. Others of course are free to trust the science over their senses. I know this bothers some but I really couldn’t be bothered by that. The folks at ASR are smart people too.
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I am not a scientist. +1, I never saw a scientist asking for a donation every time they hit the send button. I applaud your transparency about this. Because we as engineers and people who understand how audio products work, and decades of research into what kind of listening test is valid and what is not, point to generic cables performing their function way beyond call of duty. What we? This is you posting this, not we. You never spent decades of research, you never made a product. As for listening tests yes, there is published info about this, you would hate it though, it takes too much time and effort. The cable is most harmless item in your audio gear. Terrible, the CD is way more harmless. Cables can act as a choke point for the music. Yet folks focus on them and spend thousands of dollars on them. Why? Uhhh, because they felt they were worth it? Amir, don’t you get that every high end cable vendor offers return policies? You are worried about a problem that doesn’t exist, you can refund a cable that fails the pepsi challenge. You gotta make this stuff up to justify what you need to do to drive traffic to your site. Without someone to blame how else can you justify your website? If you were the least bit serious you would avail yourself to the methods you tell everyone else to do. Set up a panel of trained listeners and get on with it.
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I don’t agree with the tone of the discussion from both camps with personal judgments being hurled, and demands that one side is ultimately right and that the other side should switch their position. I think we should strive to accept that other perspectives exist and be okay with that, while being curious to understand how others arrive at their perspectives. Getting off my high-horse now…. @kota1, @amir_asr , there is an opportunity here. What about conducting a blind test by a panel, with oversight by representatives of both camps (preferably the cooler heads), and conduct a series of tests? The tests could include they typical controversial subjects:
How cool would that be. With the proper controls in place, with the proper panel to ensure equal representation of predispositions and biases, and with the proper governance, if these tests were done and published, this would be referenced for many, many years to come. It would be referenced by all review sites and pro review publications alike - for many years. It would finally advance decades of debate and inform our knowledge in a particular direction. The goal would need to be focused on advancing our knowledge rather than trying to be right. @amir_asr: people would have a huge respect for you if you pulled off such an ambitious endeavour. Think about reaching out to subjective pro reviewers to cooperate on conducting this series of tests. You need to have others on the governance panel or people will simply claim you designed it seeking a particular result to serve your interests. The results could be highly disruptive in terms of how we think of HiFi. I know Amir you might argue, been there, done that. Tests done decades ago, etc. just did a blind test last Saturday, etc. But not in such an open way, with community involvement. A lot of your naysayers would have to shut their mouths if you put your money where your mouth is and led such a community-led endeavour. And just maybe, you might learn something too. I for one would be so excited if someone took a challenge like this on - it would demonstrate true leadership in the world of HiFi IF done correctly with community engagement. The gauntlet has been thrown down!
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@amir_asr Simple suggestion. Put all Nordost power cables in your system and than swap them with Cardas. Try playing some familiar music to somebody who has zero interest in hi fi, first with one set of cables, than with other. I bet that any person with a healthy hearing would conclude that those would be two very ’different’ presentations
So, with all that science mentioned I wonder why anybody has not yet discovered the ’trick’ that cable producers use in making their power cords having a distinctive signature like their other lines of cables. Trust me, everyone hates spending money on power cables.(or usb) If you would, by any chance, ’dicover’ the method used by them (producers) and somehow find the solution to have the same influence on sound signature of some system, but without using those expensive aftermarket cables, you would be person of the year for many audiophiles. Think about it. You have consistency in ’testimonials’ from various people, who are different as they can be, with also very different systems. And yet, almost majority of them hears the same thing. Find me one person who uses Cardas power cord on Burmester gear or Nordost on Ayre (and has system that sounds ’right’) There is even perhaps some truth or use in things you do, but you ’fall’ on basics and because of it you are closing the doors for you for so many people.Nobody (in ’audiophile world’) will ever take you serious when you make claims like that. On the other hand, I would say that you might have very different motivs all together. I have met many sceptics, usually it only takes one swap of the cables for them to hear the difference. Majority of them usually could not care less about such things. But, for you its not just the cables, there are tubes, vinyl and many other thing that you got issues with. Why is that, only you know. For people who follow your ’lead’, hope one day they will come in situation where they will have a chance to hear a good sounding system.Perhaps than they might change their mind. Until than, they will for sure at least save more money than some others...after all, hi fi is a just something we do for fun...nothing profoundly serious about it.. Other than that, there is not much more to be said. We shall all go on our merry way . I would advise anyone to stay away from any further discussion with you, as there is simply no point. Likewise, people who are using insults in their conversation with you, should know better not to
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