2. amps-preamps
  3. 190587-155863

Would like to try a tube preamp after years of solid state and hybrid

I would like to replace my Counterpoint SA-1000 preamp of which I am the original owner.  I have never been satisfied with it.  I bought it as a replacement for a Hafler DH-100 pre that I bought to go with a Hafler DH-220 amp.  (I still like the amp, more so after I recapped it and upgraded a few parts.)  I did a total recap of the Counterpoint and replaced some of the rca jacks, along with a few other small things, but still find it to sound congested and dull.  In my opinion, it didn’t live up to the positive reviews that it received when it was released, but it served well in a secondary system.  My primary system makes use of an Aragon 24k preamp and 4004 amp which I find to be an acceptable level of performance.  I am using all digital sources at the moment, a JVC XL-Z1050 cd player or MacBook Pro through a Weiss DAC204.  The speakers are B&W Cm1/CM2.  Yes, with the exception of the DAC, it is all from around the same vintage.  You might be able to guess, but I have chosen components which produce a clean and crisp sound.  I am at the point that I would like to experiment with a completely different sound in the form of an old school, or near old school, tube preamp.  

 

I have been doing as much research as I can, including many thoughts from the Audiogon community, and have narrowed my choices down to the following few that are available right now, but open to other suggestions as I’m not in any rush.  I’m not a super-critical listener, but I have music training and experience, so I know what instruments and performances sound like live.  My budget is $2,000 or less plus trade value for the Counterpoint, and my goals are to get something that sounds obviously like a tube component.  I would like to equal or exceed the performance of the 24k in case I like the tubes better.  A phono stage is not required, but welcome.  I don’t like designs that have exposed tubes or showy facades (McIntosh, Zesto, PrimaLuna, etc).  I would like to get some guidance from the forum members.  

 

Conrad-Johnson PV 5, PV 10, PV 11, or other

Audible Illusions Modulus L3 or M3

Cary SLP-70

VAC Standard LE

Joule Electra LA-150 (in spite of the fact that they are out of business)

Audio Research (although I can’t decipher which model to consider - LS7, LS17, LS25?)

 

If I choose something newer, perhaps Quicksilver, AVA, Modwright, or Brown Audio Lab, but these might not sound ad "tubey" as the older units.

 

I understand that the older preamps might require some amount of rehabilitation, some of which I can do.  Nothing is a sure bet, but I would appreciate your input.

 

Thanks for any input, and best wishes!

charliehorse
lou_setriodes's avatar
lou_setriodes
688 posts
 

Charley Horse - I like what you’ve accumulated in terms of audio gear. It’s all of a certain vintage and all very good sounding, without that next level price tag and performance. All good bang for the buck gear, which is where I usually have always been with my many audio systems over the years.

I’ve owned and read countless reviews of audio gear from Stereophile, TAS, HiFi News & RR, HiFi Heretic, The Listener, etc over the year, so much more than I’ll ever be able to listen to.

 

Regarding tube preamps, I had a Music Reference RM5 mkII for many years that I just loved (with a B&K ST140, EX442, Paoli M70 monos, and a Music Reference RM9) but for some odd reason, it wouldn’t mate up well with the c/m MV50 I had. What was mind blowing was that when I sent it in for a simple mute circuit repair, I had a $89 (at the time) lowly Dyna PAS2 inserted in my system for a few months. It was earth shattering how good this sounded, so much so, that when my MR pre came back, I preferred the PAS2.

 

When I had the cj MV50, I really wished I could have found a PV5 to mate it with. I don’t have any experience with cj preamps, but from what I’ve read, if you can find a cj Premier 2 or Premier 3 preamp, they are steps above the PV5.


Other great tube preamps that I read about that are a cut above are:

 

Berning TF10A or AH, Audio Research SP-6B, Counterpoint SA5 or 5.1, AVA Super PAS, Moscode Minuet in A, and MFA Majus….but if you are not using a silver IC between amp & pre, I would start there before changing preamps.


Have fun on the preamp journey,

Lou

charliehorse OP
12 posts
 

Lou, Thanks for the thoughtful response and encouragement.  It can be funny and surprising about equipment, good is good regardless of the cost.  I don't want this to deviate into cables, so I sent you a pm.

I will read up on the suggestions that you, and the more recent contributors have made as some of them are unfamiliar.  You made the third mention of the ARC SP-6B.  The journey has been fun, and the enthusiasm that has been shared has been inspiring.

Thanks, Kevin

lou_setriodes's avatar
lou_setriodes
688 posts
 

I heard both the SP-6B and the SP8 at different times and on different systems.  The person who owned the 6B had also said it was the best of the SP6’s (SP6A - SP6E).  I also read from the later Roger Modjewski (Music Reference) in his tech days before starting MR, that he hated working on Audio Research gear, that the circuitry was always over complicated and difficult to work on.  So something to keep in mind perhaps.  I’ll look for your private message.  The journey is the fun part :).

charliehorse OP
12 posts
 

Lou, Thanks again.  I have been reading all of the praises regarding ARC equipment, and I'm sure that it is justified.  When I looked at photos of the inside of the SP-6B, for instance, it does look very crowded.  I have very limited experience tinkering with electronics, but simpler is usually easier.

charliehorse OP
12 posts
 

Thanks to all who have shared their advice and experience with me.  Unfortunately, vehicle repairs were WAY more than expected and have put this idea on hold.  In the meantime, I have been re-capping some older equipment.

Cheers!

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