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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Hotroady

Here is the quote from Steen and the link. I think he is clear on physical size and for sure I agree. It is also very easy to see why the idea is made fun of. ($$$ for big caps)

"An inductor coil MUST have low, very low resistance and capacitance — meaning that it by higher values will be heavy measured in kilograms of copper/silver and of the single layer band type.

Only if a resistor is in series with the inductor and no capacitor to ground between, this resistance can be built into the coil and a lot of copper/silver is spared.

The capacitors must act in the same manner with extremely low resistance meaning lots of conductive material. Again they will be larger and heavier, not much to do about that. Of course it goes for this part too, that a resistance can be built in as also inductance but then the free use of the part is heavily reduced.

From the great variety of types - stick to stack foils or variations on that theme if you can find them without plastics. The good old Micas works wonderfully well but they are far too expensive for greater values. Go for older types following the simple rule that bigger is better".

http://www.meta-gizmo.net/Tri/speak/STEEN.html
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
DGarretson

In that article it talked about it not being very hard to take an amp to triode mode. Have you ever done that?

I find the part 1 even more interesting and did not know that SET had really never been heard by many until it's revivial with good source material. I never really thought about it? Another was the 300b was never released to the public?

http://www.nutshellhifi.com/library/tinyhistory1.html
hotroady
4 posts
 
Thanks Volley guy, it makes sense. Jon L had a pic somewhere of Ampohms, showing them much larger than Mundorfs of same values. Been looking at the copper foils, for my amp. I've also contemplated making my Fisher X-1000 triode. Only thing is; would want to add a switch for either mode. I should still get 25+ watts per channel in triode mode.
hotroady
4 posts
 
You might have to scroll down, but there is a pic of Ampohm compared to Mundorf cap. http://www.head-fi.org/forums/f21/orgy-capacitors-cap-thread-284863/index11.html
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Hotroady

It is just my personal opinion but I think you are right to stick to copper foils for your amp of some kind. I read many stories of vintage amps going to poly of which Mundorf is and losing the tone. My own experience is you do best by bettering the same kind of part but of better quality. Meaning your amp was voiced on foil caps. Mundorf would be better than a lower grade poly if that was what was in an amp.

Now what is better about that famous amp you have? Different tubes, better caps?

I did just check out the Ampohms and it is quite interesting and for me I am not surprised they sound tonally better than Mundorf Silver in Oil. It is also interesting on the thread you posted I have read JonL thread before. The price sure is right. I just wonder about resonance? That is the downfall to foil caps keeping them from resonating.
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