Direct Drive vs. Idler Drive vs. Belt drive

@elexberger

My friend I talked about have a huge experience. Actually he is the most famost vintage audio intusiast in Israel. So I trust his opinion.

I enjoyed my stay in Israel last autumn, i’ve seen great sound systems and nice setups. Audiophile scene is pretty strong in Israel as far as i know. Why your friend is not on audiogon yet ? :))

One my friend had in his system:Kenwood L-07D, EMT 948, Technics SP10mk2, Yamaha GT-2000. He liked Yamaha the most and EMT the second. But, to his taste: L-07D and SP10mk2 sound too sterile.

Anyway, when someone telling us "this turntable is sterile" compared to others it’s very important to understand why.

As you mentioned he has L-07D which comes with it’s own tonearm made by Micro Seiki.

Yamaha GT-2000 comes with it’s own Yamaha tonearm, not very popular tonearm by the way.

Those two turntables are for sale as complete units (with pre-mounted tonearms).

Technics SP-10 mkII is just a drive and available separately. I’ve tried at least 3 tonearms (Reed 3p "12, EPA-100 "10.5, Schick "12 ... on my ex SP-10 mkII and the sound with each tonearm was different. Do you understand what i mean ?

Not sure about EMT, but most likely it’s a complete unit with EMT own tonearm? Old ortofon or New Schick is also popular on EMT...

When your friend comparing L-07D (with Kenwood/MicroSeiki tonearm) to Yamaha (with Yamaha tonearm) he’s comparing complete units/turntables factory assembled. Even if the cartridge is the same, the combination of the cartridge and tonearm might change the sound.

When he’s using SP-10 mkII he could add almost any tonearm and the sound with each tonearm will be different. In this situation it’s not fair to say that Technics SP-10 mkII is sterile, because SP-10 mkII is just the drive, not a complete turntables. If he put together SP-10 mkII with some tonearm and plinth then the choice of the plinth and tonearm is critical (not to mention the most important part as a phono cartridge matched to the tonearm).

And all 4 turntables (Kenwood, Yamaha, EMT and Technics) are Direct Drive at least.

I’m not a typical audiophile and I don’t change equipment too often. I have been using EMT 948 since 2011 and I am not going to change it. The truth is, I could live with Lenco L78. It was a very nice, musical turntable.

This is why i’m trying to make it clear. Same with your Lenco, did you try EMA and Lenco with the same tonearm/cartridge ?

Because if someone comparing turntables there are a lot of combinations of the plinth, arms, carts, mats, feet etc. A fair comparison of the drive must be done with the same tonearm/cartridge on all turntables, when you will be able to "hear" the drive and comment about the drive itself.

The rest is just speculations.

I have both the DN 308 :-)  (actually I have several of them ) and a EMT 950 booth are excellent machines.

https://pbnaudio.com/pbn-dn308/

Good Listening

Peter

Hi @chakster ,
This my friend Guy Landau appired on different forums from 1990x. I don’t know on which forums he appears right now.
I don’t have data which tonarm did he used with each of these turtables. I remember he used FR64 old version on sp10.
But I know he likes to play with different tonearms and he has anough experience to recognize what and how influenced to the total sound.

I used SME 3009mk2 on Lenco and 20kg birch playwood plinth. I used Ortofon Jubilee and Ortofon Rondo Bronze cartridges.
I used the same cartridges on Nottingham Spacedeck with Spacearm tonearm.
I use EMT 929 to arm on EMT948 with EMT TSD15 SFL and TSD15 SPH cartridges.
I used the same phonostage with all turtables.

Dear @mikelavigne : """  these things are always degrees of success, trade-offs and compromises. again, anything mechanical can only approach perfection. ..."""

As you I think you own 3 different drive TTs where each one is  one of the best on its kind out there and due to the top quality level you are experienced with more than real compromises or trade-offs what exist is " only " just top quality performance but with different  " color " that as you said all are approaching perfection at levels you don't experienced before.

I'm sure that each of your TTs designers are really satisfied with the way the items performs.

R.

I think HP of all people nailed it when he noted that digital reproduction effects a high pass filter albeit at a very low frequency which seems to rob the music of its natural ambiance. The bass drops off a cliff, metaphorically speaking. You don’t hear it as lack of bass per se.

@lewm  In a nutshell, vinyl has more bandwidth than Redbook. On the bottom end its only limited by the mechanical resonance of the playback. On the top end it can go out well past 50KHz, although my cutter is bandwidth-limited at about 42KHz.