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Ethics: To what degree?

I am in a difficult position. As a member of the Agon community I’ve read threads that have dealt with the problems other members have had with various manufacturers, distributors or dealers. From a safe distance it’s always been easier to empathize with any of the parties involved, until some new information tips the balance in one direction or another. Sometimes other Agon’ers side with different parties in the dispute, making for entertaining and enlightening dialogue.

As someone who has close friends in the high end business, and as someone who has a deep emotional investment in the hobby, I can say I understand very well the pitfalls faced by anyone who struggles to make a living by manufacturing, marketing or selling luxury devices that are, arguably, not intrinsic to daily life. And it’s important to separate the user side from the seller side, because expectations are rarely synchronous. Moreover, we’re all human beings with different sets of values, mores and ethics – what some deem as inexcusable, others might consider not only acceptable, but expectable.

So what’s my problem? That is whether to bring to this forum my recent experiences with a well-known high-end manufacturer, whose products are almost universally admired or loved. I won’t yet mention the name of the manufacturer because events are still playing out…and yet this is one of the points that I wish to address here with the hopes that the community will help me determine what I should do.

I have loved this product. It has been an integral part of my system – a system that is of extreme importance to me since I use it in my professional work. I purchased the product with some concern because the local dealer had just brought the product in and wasn’t really familiar with it. I was, to my knowledge, his first customer of this product. The unit was actually employed – with my permission – as an audition unit before I took possession. I received a 10% discount – the smallest discount I have ever received, which is interesting since I have received very favorable pricing accommodation from high-end dealers elsewhere around the country – which should indicate the level of my interest. Within weeks of my purchase the unit had to travel to the Midwest, to the factory authorized tech, for a repair under warranty. After its return the unit functioned without flaw until about seven weeks ago when it failed. The failure was mechanical and the warranty has expired. The US distributor and I are at an impasse over the use of replacement parts, not to mention costs of repair versus replacement. Since the company insists on replacement, at a very high cost, the money I would make from a subsequent sale will be considerably less. I will leave the story there, until I hear from other members who feel any definitive information should be included in this thread. I will note that two very high-profile members of the high-end community were shocked when I told them what was occurring and one, whose name you all know well (but who would like to remain above the fray for obvious reasons), just told me to cut my losses and move on. I tend to agree with him.

My quandary is this: the US distributor knows that I intend to sell this product so he is banking on my keeping quiet about my distress - at least until after I sell it. Ethically, I don’t believe I can keep quiet about this situation; as a member of the community I feel compelled to disclose my experience not just to a potential buyer of my component but also to anyone who might consider purchasing one of this company’s products. Frankly, the issue for me is the complete lack of empathy from the distributor and the complete unwillingness to find a compromise; and as one whose business stems completely from references, I find this behavior to be an anathema.

How, and where do other members stand on this situation? Is there value in detailing this interaction, even at the potential cost to my wallet?
islandear
kthomas
911 posts
 
It sounds more like a question of economics than ethics. If you sell a unit that has had repairs, you should be very forthright in describing that to any potential buyer. If a broken unit was replaced with new unit, and that new unit has not suffered any working issues, I wouldn't think you'd be obligated to detail any issues you had with a different unit of the same type.

I think there is always value in people relaying their experiences, good or bad, in dealing with manufacturers when things go wrong with their products. I would always wait until I believe the matter is closed, for better or worse, but a factual recount of what happened and your customer satisfaction level is yours to share. Is there going to be a hit to your wallet in doing so - maybe, dunno. Certainly if that is a worry to you, not relaying your story is the safer bet. I don't think you have any obligation to tell a potential buyer about your customer satisfaction level with a manufacturer, just the history and current status of the piece in question.
lak's avatar
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lak
4,680 posts
 
Islandear,
I agree with Kthomas and also feel the following:
I suspect many of us that have been into high-end for many years have both positive and negative stories of manufactures, distributors, and retailers that have either bent over backwards to assist us doing more than what is necessary. Others out there have might not be true of their word or only do what they feel they are legally responsible for.
My recommendation (without knowing the details) is after those that are involved have completed their service; fill us in on the details so that others don’t fall into the same scenario. Of course I also feel that the others involved should be made aware of this forum, so that they may also if they wish post their opinions in an open forum.
pbb
1,140 posts
 
Very nice post, form-wise. What community? Why all this roundabout way of doing things? So you want to blow the whistle but you haven’t the guts. We all face situations were a product fails and we deal with it the best we can. Will a company be swayed by seeing its name on 'Agon in a post of the "shocked and appalled" type? I doubt it. Your emotional involvement is getting in the way of settling this. As long as you tell the truth, no one should be unduly upset.

It seems you think you have some kind of advantage over run-of-the-mill audiophiles because of your status.

What is that special status that you have or crave anyway?
rhanson739
269 posts
 
Islandear,

First, I'd like to say that I appreciate the quality of your post and the manner in which you wrote it.

I don't know any more about the situation than you've given us here, but I'd make a suggestion to look at and understand the different perspectives one could take when looking at this dilemma.

On the one hand, there is a manufacturer who made a unit, brought it to market, covered it with a warranty for a certain time period, and would surely like to sell more of the units. You've presented a unit that had a mechanical failure, but the warranty has expired. The position of the manufacturer is understandable: coverage for free repair is over.

On the other hand, there is your perspective: you're upset about the failure, you've been in high-end for a long time, and you think that your level of involvement entitles you to special consideration beyond the warranty. That's understandable, too, up to a point, but at what point in time would these considerations expire?

In other words, perhaps you are both right. The trick is how to reconcile the two perspectives to the satisfaction of both parties.

The piece of information that may be missing is the answer to the question, "Why does the manufacturer insist on replacement instead of repair?" Is the mechanical failure so heinous that it simply can't be fixed at all? Could there be another reason that they insist on replacement instead of repair, a reason that we may not be aware of at the time?

From all you've said, I think that if the warranty has expired and a replacement is required, then take the hit. If I bought any piece of equipment, whether it be a stereo component or a washing machine, if it breaks and the warranty has expired, I would expect the manufacturer to charge for the repairs or replacement, regardless of any special privilege I feel for being on the playing field for a long time (I've been washing clothes for years and years! I don't expect special treatment from Maytag.)

Of course you're angry; this kind of situation is annoying and time-consuming in the extreme. You seem angry enough to want to do something about it. But for you to make this situation and your outrage public would likely be unfair to the manufacturer, from the little I know. Would going public with your anger make you feel better about it? It might be good to ensure that you have a "leg to stand on" with your perspective before you get up and shout about it.

My $0.0175 (adjusted for inflation.)

Rob
narrod
1,064 posts
 
Just tell the truth without embellishment. Any manufacturer and/or distributor who can't stand up to the factual situation doesn't deserve loyalty or future business.
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