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No deep bass or highs: VTF or VTA issue?

Background:

I've been using JM Lab Micro Utopia monitors and recently added a sub (via Bryston outboard crossover). Used my music server to dial in the sub (for convenience) and after dialing it in I noticed that my analog rig is not sounding anywhere as good as my digital.

I tried comparing a few LPs to their digital counterparts and in comparison the LPs sounded dark and sluggish.

Relevant equipment:

Analog:
- Dynavector XV-1s
- Scoutmaster / JMW 9 Signature / SDS / Super platter etc
- Aesthetix Rhea Signature with NOS tubes

Digital:
Music server -> Benchmark DAC

I used a Mint tractor to align the cartridge, and the VTF on the XV-1s is around 2.0g. I had never done anything about VTA, so I tried raising it. It got somewhat brighter, but now in comparison it lacks deep bass AND the highs of the digital version. Switching back and forth it's like the vinyl is just midrange (that's an exaggeration to illustrate my point).

I also have a Manley Steelhead phono stage; I should probably swap that with the Rhea to make sure the phono stage isn't the culprit but my gut tells me that it's the setup.

Any advice on what adjustments to try would be much appreciated.

Thanks.
madfloyd
madfloyd OP
411 posts
 
I never really directly compared digital to analog prior to adding the sub.

I'm now wondering if my problem was simply VTA was off and by changing it I've messed up overhang.
almarg's avatar
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almarg
9,670 posts
 
Ian -- My understanding is that the Mint Tractor is customized based on the exact pivot-to-spindle distance of the particular arm. Are you certain that the mounting hole for the arm is drilled in exactly the right place on the armboard, and that the pivot-to-spindle distance that the Mint was customized to corresponds to the actual distance?

Also, I would expect that the effects of geometry-related problems would vary depending on what part of the record is being played. Do you notice any such variation, or are the character and magnitude of the symptoms consistent throughout the record?

Regards,
-- Al
dgad
782 posts
 
One more idea. Listen with headphones and compare CD to Analogue. This will let you know if your subwoofer is interacting w. the turntable.
dougdeacon
3,338 posts
 
Al,

If Ian's tonearm mounting distance weren't right he would know it. With an arc protractor like the Mint the stylus either tracks precisely along an arc or it doesn't. If it does, tonearm mounting distance is correct by definition.

Ian,

As Swampwalker confirmed, your suspicion is correct. For any given cartridge mounting position, moving the armtube away from level shortens overhang while moving it toward level lengthens overhang, as you figured.

Therefore, before using ANY cartridge alignment protractor we should adjust arm height (and VTF) to approximate normal playing values WITH THE STYLUS SITTING ON THE SURFACE OF THE PROTRACTOR.

With the Mint this means raising the arm, since the Mint is thicker than most (all?) LP's. Do your setup and then return the arm to its normal height for LP play.

That said, I doubt this is the cause of your lack of "air". I had plenty of air before acquiring my Mint. Using it improved other things, but not really this.
madfloyd OP
411 posts
 
I was all set to switch back to my 20XL cart this morning. Removed the red cable and noticed the white was disconnected. Made me wonder if it was loose so back the TT went for another listen. Sigh, no change.

If anyone is willing to do this test: assuming you have both CD and analog copy of Nowhere Man (Beatles), do you hear a gracious amount of reverb on the opening (acapella) vocals? On CD I do - the vocals are in the right channel and I hear stereo reverb that sounds beautiful. On LP I don't hear much at all - it's there (I think) but so subtle that I have to really tune into it - while on the CD it is very present in the mix. Don't know if this is mastering (I'm using the Beatles Blue Box) or my setup.

Dgad: sub is not the issue. I can bypass it - and the digital source is playing through the same rig.
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