Searching for matching(?) Subwoofer solution

Hi @hleeid,

My rig is nowhere near the quality as some you folks here but where I did spend some coin was on the subwoofers. I had owned many SVS subs over these short few years but was never quite satisfied with them. Then doing research as we do when looking to ’upgrade’ I stumbled across the Power Sound Audio or PSA AVS Forum. To make a long story short I ended buying 2 subs from PSA after researching the Vandersteen brand of subs and a bunch of others.

Apparently the ’Vandy’s’ as they are so affectionately called are a well beloved sub here on Gon and elsewhere and this is what Mr. Vandersteen had to say about subwoofers:

’Mono or Stereo Bass

There are significant advantages to using two subwoofers. Modern sources such as streaming, CDs, DVDs, digital high-resolution music files, and Blu-ray Discs maintain full stereo separation to below 20Hz. Summing the channels into a single subwoofer reduces or cancels all the low-frequency information containing phase differences between the channels. Stereo subwoofers reproduce all of the bass information complete with the phase differences that help provide the imaging and location cues we use to place people and things at distinct points in the sound field. Stereo subwoofers also improve linearity on mono as well as stereo sources by coupling the bass to the room at two points and lend themselves to natural placement near the corners where low frequency room gain is often desirable.

Ultimate Multi-Channel

A pair of SUB THREE subwoofers is the premier configuration for high-quality multi-channel home theater systems where the surround-sound processor can be programmed to redirect the LFE (Low Frequency Effects) information to the main speakers. In addition to the benefits of stereo bass, disabling the surround processor’s LFE output often improves the system ’s midrange clarity and articulation. For the ultimate system, additional SUB THREE’s can be added to the surround channels.’

After reading about what Mr. Vandersteen had to say about subwoofers it was good enough for me and researching PSA subs I knew I couldn’t afford the Vandy’s but I could afford dual PSA subs.

One of the owners of PSA is Tom Vodhanel who was/is the ’V’ in SVS subwoofers.

Here are some of the reasons I bought PSA subs:

1) They are very well built.

2) Have very forward engineering.

3) Have a 5 year warranty. Even the used ones in the PSA outlet center. And there is nothing wrong with buying used as they are thoroughly gone through and up to specs and  are very cost effective.

4) Customer service is the best in the subwoofer business.

5) Has a trade up/trade in/trade down policy and not only pays for the shipping TO the customer but pays for shipping the subs BACK to the PSA manufacturing site! This comes in handy when you want to audition at home.

6) They sound damn good too, without that annoying booming sound some sub manufactures have. Just good clear, clean sound.

7) Has many subwoofer choices with multiple price points and all the PSA subs benefit from the company’s same proprietary designs.

Here is the website: https://www.powersoundaudio.com

rauliruegas:
"Even the AK SWARM manufacturer/owner posted in this forum:

""" You can get good bass in one sweet spot with two equalized subs """. Not 3 or 4 but TWO.

Obviously that for him the 4 SWARM is not his personal " religion " and he is the man behind the AK sales ! ! !

R."


Hello rauliruegas,

     Easy, I completely agree and said so on my first post on this thread.  Here's a direct quote of my initial post:

"Everything millercarbon stated is true, a 4-sub distributed bass array is the best solution. However, in a home office environment in which I'm assuming you'll be listening primarily from your desk chair, I think a pair of SVS-SB1000 subs, currently on sale for 1/2 price at $499 each and $950 for a pair, will provide very good bass performance, if properly positioned in your room, that will also integrate or blend with any pair of main speakers used. There's absolutely no need to use the same brand subs as your main speakers and you're going to save at least $7,000.
    Here's a link to the SVS website and the SB1000 subs:"

     Calm down, everything's going to be okay.

Tim

tyray:
"Apparently the ’Vandy’s’ as they are so affectionately called are a well beloved sub here on Gon and elsewhere and this is what Mr. Vandersteen had to say about subwoofers:

’Mono or Stereo Bass

There are significant advantages to using two subwoofers. Modern sources such as streaming, CDs, DVDs, digital high-resolution music files, and Blu-ray Discs maintain full stereo separation to below 20Hz. Summing the channels into a single subwoofer reduces or cancels all the low-frequency information containing phase differences between the channels. Stereo subwoofers reproduce all of the bass information complete with the phase differences that help provide the imaging and location cues we use to place people and things at distinct points in the sound field. Stereo subwoofers also improve linearity on mono as well as stereo sources by coupling the bass to the room at two points and lend themselves to natural placement near the corners where low frequency room gain is often desirable."

Hello tyray,

     I seriously doubt someone as knowledgeable and experienced as Mr. Vandersteen would make the numerous obviously false statements contained in your supposed quote of him you cited above in your last post.

     Please verify this quote as valid by referencing  your source for this quote.  I'm almost certain you'll be unable to do so, however, and you'll likely just fail to ever provide any reference, never admitting to your deliberate false quote.

    To keep this simple, I'll just take your lack of posting and citing a valid quote reference in the next 48 hours as your admission of knowingly misquoting Mr. Vandersteen.

     In other words, I'm calling you on your b.s.

Tim

Dear @noble100  : """  , a 4-sub distributed bass array is the best solution. """

For who or whom?. Certainly was and is the best solution for you or millercarbon but thta does not means is the best solution for other gentlemans.

Your needs, priorities, room system, MUSIC/sound experiences, ears sensitivity,  knowledge levels and many other things are not the same for all of us.
So, there is not that " best solution ". That's what you like it nd that's all.

In the other side the HT needs are different than the specific needs for people like me or the OP that only want to use our room/system  to listen MUSIC in  two channel equipment where normlly we re looking for the higher quality level we can chieve with the higher room/system resolution.

Quality first and quantity not main target.

Problem is that in  a thread you read " subwoofer " and your personal solution is the 4 AK Swarm no matters what.

No one own a perfect system and certainly not yours or mine. Who told you that to listen only MUSIC in a system the best is your solution: who?

Certainly it's not the " best solution ". With passive speaker designs two good quality subs are what we need.

Seems to me that your posts are way  HT oriented that goes more in specific to your solution. For just MUSIC your approach is wrong/non-adequated, at least for me.

In your solution you don't care about the quality of the subs but I care a lot of and I'm not only talking of the subs facilities but its overall quality performance levels that's why I choosed Velodyne. Yes for other audiophiles preferences can be different there are several very good subs out there.

Normally no one cares about subs distortion levels and as  fact the subs manufacturers just does not disclose in the subs THD specs. That I remember only Velodyne did it but other more expensive subs as the ones by JL udio does not do it. The 0.5% THD in Velodyne is an achievement. 
The JL Audio ( I can't remember the model. ) through  Stereophile review  measured a  value around 5%-6% ! !

I'm sure that you don't care about in the same way I do it.

People like me are looking for subs that can't degrade the bass information range that we take out from the main speakers. So we are looking for better mid/high frequency range quality levels along better overall bass frequency range quality levels too. We want it " all ".

Anyway, obviously you are free to post what you want. No problem but I explain my self in the overall subject because does not exist " a good for all solutions " and that AK DBA/Swarm solution is at a very low price point that goes along same quality levels.If we need quality then we have to pay for it.

R.

Hello rauliruegas,

     You really need to chillax, my friend, you might burst something important.  
     Didn't you read my last post stating I agree with you?  More specifically, I believe that the Swarm DBA system is an exceptionally good bass solution for music and HT but may not be the best solution for everyone.  I think each individual's bass requirements, room and system circumstances and budgets create unique situations that deserve unique bass system solutions.  
     I know high quality, large and expensive subs are not always necessary for good overall performance but also understand using better quality subs normally can only improve results.  I agree that low sub distortion is important, there are many good subs on the market and good bass performance can be achieved using one or more subs in a given room provided they're positioned and configured properly.

     My intent for this post was to make it crystal clear that I agree with you and then request you just cut it out. Agreed?


Thanks,
  Tim