SET vs ICE vs GAINCLONE vs HYBRID vs other?

Doron,

I haven't posted on this in awhile but thought it worth updating for those interested. I sold the JAS because it was an absolute monster in size and put out a hellish amount of heat. I also had a hum issue with my main speakers which didn't materialize with other speakers I owned. I had both GE and RCA 805's, Sophia Meshplate 300B's, Ediswans 5358 and Amperex orange label/globe 6JD8's, and Tung Sol black glass 12au7 & Brimar 13D5 (12au7). I had no issues with sound aside from the hum.
Plus, of course, I'm an audiophile and absolutely MUST try other components, even when satisfied with the ones I own!

On to the Pathi....I mentioned a general satisfaction with a pair of bridged Pathos Classic MK III though not quite up to SET levels but close enough. Hogwash! The Pathi are quite nice-very good detail, nice, big holographic soundstage with very good focus, and a good overall musicality to them but they just aren't transparent enough.
After hearing a good 805/300B with a passive linestage, most amps sounds slightly to unequivacally opaque. Ditto for Pathi, unfortunately. Sold them and picked up a AudioSector Patek integrated on the cheap until I could do better. This is a very different sound from the Pathi but it looses nothing in terms of detail and presence though it isn't as up-front but it does get pretty close in transparency to the SET amp. It may well be the best affordable solid state option to SET lovers IF you have a system already balanced to the warm and full side. YMMV

Hi,

I agree with the weight and the heat statements - therefore this amps is placed in my basement (doubling as area heater..:-).
I have very mild hum on the left side transformer but it is not coming from the speaker. Just the transformer itself (mechanical hum) and very mild so I cannot hear from my listening seat when it is idling or playing music.
A signal hum could be fixed as sometimes it is just a capacitor relocation (when a regulating/heater capacitor is too close to the signal path). Been there. Fixed it.

The reason I asked is because my experience is that with the right tubes and with capacitors changes (trial and error) this unit can move from being a "magical midrange producer" to a SOTA, top to bottom performer beating, with matching speakers, to my ears, units costing many many times its asking price.
When you buy a unit from Pathos, VTL, ARC, Macintosh etc,etc you are afraid to touch these units since it will not allow you to sell them in a modified state.
Good sound takes second place to resale-ability.
With a relatively low initial cost, a modified JAS is a lower risk and the sonic results are more than just surprising. After almost 3 years with this amp and after hearing many very expensive amplifiers, utilizing different topologies (SET, Push-Pull, OTL’s, Z-OTL’s) not to mention expensive solid state units, I have yet to find an amp that is emotionally communicative as this one (the goosebumps test).
When you read some audio history, you find that there is nothing new under the sun as far as amplifiers circuits. Most were invented and optimized prior to 1954 and most of today’s gains were made with better passive parts.
The best Japanese renditions of SET technology (WAVAC, Kondo, Yamamoto, to name a few) have mostly to do with better transformers, capacitors, signal wires, etc, etc.
In other words the dish becomes better when the chef uses the same old recipes but uses better ingredients.
Most commercial audio units (not just amps) cannot use the best tubes, capacitors, inductors, transformers due to cost/effectiveness and scarceness of supply, unless time and money are no object (custom built amplifiers from a designer) so they leave it to us, if we dare to experiment.

Just my two cents,

Doron

When you read some audio history, you find that there is nothing new under the sun as far as amplifiers circuits. Most were invented and optimized prior to 1954 and most of today’s gains were made with better passive parts.

This statement is not correct; there have been new patents issued on tube amplifier topologies since the 1950s. Also I don't know of any fully differential tube amps or preamps that were built in the 1950s; that is definitely something new (the first such preamps were made in 1989 and the first such amps only a few years earlier).

To an extent you are right in the sense that OTL's are relatively new. "SET OTL" Hybrids (Buttler MONAD) are somewhat new too and Z-OTL (David Berning) can be referred as such too but this is not reinventing the wheel. It is more like a variation on existing technologies and the funny part is that after all the so-called-advancement in audio, in the last 15 years there seem to be a retro movement to go back to tube technology and analogue sources.

Lcherepkai,

Speaking about transparency,
I think OTL's and SET are the best I have heard but I will add that to my ears OTL sounded more effortless, extended, linear and SET sounded more lush (concentrated, immediate and textured midrange) and colorful ("expressionistic").
I would say it is almost like watching reality through two sets of transparent glasses but one is tinted so the picture could be rosy.
To each his own. I am SET guy but can appreciate OTL (technically, OTL can likely be better but emotionally it is a matter of taste/preference) and generally speaking to my ears, well implemented, these two topologies are at the top of the audio food chain, all things considered.