speakers for classical music

Hi Dave,
Sorry to hear many of you disagree. Of course opinions are like bottoms... everyone has one. I am just glad everyone doesnt disagree with me.

It is very hard to explain audiophile experiences in short sound bites.

Of course the B&W 801d and all B&W speakers (including Mackie) are box speakers. What I mean with boxes is the lengths speaker makers can go to to damp the box and make the box disappear sonically vs cost. Usually this attention seems to come (unfortunately) with more expensive speakers.

The B&W 801D is expensive but good if powered well. Box speakers of its quality and better get very very expensive (Wilson/Kharma/Acapella/Marten etc).

I mentioned that "boxes are a bad place to start" only because makers like Magnepan give you a full range package thats very hard to beat at the mid price level partly because they do away with the box and its complications. All the weight of the braced box has to be built and shipped around the world which all impacts on the cost and quality of the product you get. Never mind the drivers.

Magnepan (and planars) have their problems too (large dynamics at high volume being one) but when driven well and used for naturally recorded music at reasonable SPLs they are very hard to beat. I dont know of any box speaker around $1500 new that can get so much right like the Magnepan, let alone going up the range to MG3.6r and MG20.1. Although you start to get close to Avantgarde territory then.

The world is full of ok speakers, but to find a complete and natural sounding speaker at any price is difficult. If you like valve or transistor amps all has to come into the equation. But if you are looking for low coloration and speed with extension the field narrows very quickly.

You make the point that if you cant afford a full range speaker then make do with the compromise of a mini monitor. Well maybe, but come on, if you are an audiophile how can you compromise on extension? I dont think so. Also remember the question did ask for floor standers... Headphones anyone?

Chadeffect said:
"You make the point that if you cant afford a full range speaker then make do with the compromise of a mini monitor. Well maybe, but come on, if you are an audiophile how can you compromise on extension? I dont think so. Also remember the question did ask for floor standers... Headphones anyone?"

You just spent the whole post about the glories of the compromised Maggies. (In my view, compromised in both extension and dynamic potential). How can now say that such a compromise isn't an option for an audiophile???

Maggies a few things very, very well and I understand why many are attracted to them. I would just caution, if you're leaning toward Maggies make sure that you can do without bass extention and dynamic range.

With mini-monitors I would caution to make sure that you can do without extention. (Depending on the speaker you might not give up a lot of dynamic range, but that'll take power also).

Come to think of it, the OP never gave us a budget did he, other than to imply that 803s were in range.

Headphones indeed, an excellent option IMHO for anyone that wants "it all" on a budget. You actually can get everything but the flapping pants legs from headphones.

Dave

Shadorne, from my minor experience. . . JRDG 7M delivering max 170A peak ad damping factor of 170 is borderline for controlling bass drivers of Vienna Mahlers. At 1000, JRDG 501s and 312 seem just about right. . . Nuforce at 4000 is perhaps overdampening them. JRDG further indicated that the 301 monos with damping factor of 60 may end up a little loose on Mahlers. . . hence my concerns about MC402. . . I'll be glad to be proven wrong if someone can test the configuration in question.

Shadorne, from my minor experience. . . JRDG 7M delivering max 170A peak ad damping factor of 170 is borderline for controlling bass drivers of Vienna Mahlers. At 1000, JRDG 501s and 312 seem just about right. . . Nuforce at 4000 is perhaps overdampening them.

My point is that you can't control them any further than having an amp with 0 output impedance (although you can go negative but that is another story).

Damping of 4 is equivalent to output impedance of 2 Ohms whilst 40 is equivalent to 0.2 ohms whilst 400 is equivalent to 0.02 whilst 4000 damping is like 0.002....so the difference is very small as all the last three are basically pretty much all a short. So the natural mechanical/electrical damping of the voice coil and mechanical suspension + air suspension will really begin to dominate as you go above 40 damping from the amp.

However, what you observed means it still has an audible effect which suggests the speaker design is probably underdamped.

HI Dave,
there is an issue with volume in the bass with the smaller Maggies, but not to the point where they are that compromised. But the quality of the bass and the pluses like the open midrange, treble extension, inner detail and naturalness for classical music would be very tempting.

I do take your point about dynamic potential. A good amp can help that to a point, but for sure a frustration in their design along with size.

The problem of knowing a budget becomes so important. But I guess as the 803 is mentioned we are talking about $2500. You would get a hell of a pair of headphones for that!