surface noise and cartridge/ phono pre questions


Ok, here it goes. I'm very green to analog but thanks to Agon, I have so far been lead in the right direction. I'll cut the bull and get to it.
I'm currently using a Music Hall 5.1se, AT140LC cart, Musical Suroundings Nova Phonomena phono pre with a DIY phono interconnect. I'm loading the cart at 50k, gain at 40db, going into a AE-3 pre. I've made many adjustments to VTA (SRA), VTF....etc. currently I'm at approx -2degrees on VTA and 1.46g on VTF. I also tried a Shure V15 IV w/ ed saunders stylus, never could get it to sound right to me.
I'm very happy with the sound now and I think it's really close to the proper set up. I have Alison Krauss "So Long So Wrong" last 2 tracks of side 2 sounding sweet!!! The problem....I seam to be getting surface noise and pops with recordings that I would think should be better.
My main question. I tried using a lower cart loading, (2k) obviously this is to low, sounds super clean, black and quiet. Again, obviously, the highs totally diminish. Any suggestions on a direction I should go to obtain this sort of quietness without losing my high end?
I'm very new to this and learning daily but if I'm chasing my tail with my phono pre, cart, tonearm compatibilty, I'm open for suggestions. The more I read on here, it's sounding like this could be the difference in a really good phono pre. I really like the sound of the AT140 and feel that it is a good match for my humble tonearm and system. I'm curious on what you guys think and suggest.
If this is not enough info, I'll try to give more.
Just a quick note, I just hooked up the AE-3 pre last night and It's really something else for such an inexpensive investment. Great match for my SET45.
1gear
Static charge on records is also a very strong candidate, especially if your in house conditions include lack of humidity. First things first.
Jcarr, I think you may find this article by Nelson Pass to be interesting:

https://passlabs.com/articles/audio-distortion-and-feedback

It seems to re-enforce some of your comments above. Norman Crowhurst wrote about some of this as well, although I'm don't have a link handy, I suspect I could find the article on Pete Millet's website given enough time :)

Essentially though, the issue as I see it is that as you add feedback, the problem/solution is in the way the 5th 7th and 9th harmonics are handled, but you also have concerns with intermodulation at the feedback node. This can result in a harmonic and *inharmonic* noise floor, with harmonics up to the 81st (although the circuit may lack the bandwidth for that).

The concern I have has to do with human hearing rules. The 5th, 7th and 9th are measured by the ear brain system to determine how loud the sound actually is; so if they are altered even in very tiny amounts the sound will be artificially louder and brighter than it really is.

There is also the issue of detail- due to the ear's masking rule, louder sounds can block the presence of quieter sounds. If the louder sounds are distortion then you will have less detail. It turns out that the one exception to the masking rule is the ability to hear into a noise floor composed of hiss; the ear can hear about 20 db into such a noise floor (something usually ignored by digital advocates). I suspect that this may be because analog hiss has a lot in common with wind noise, something with which our ear/brain system is very familiar. But if the noise floor is composed of harmonic and inharmonic noise, the detail below it will be lost as the ear cannot hear into that kind of noise floor.

If you want a link to Crowhurst's comments regarding this feedback phenomena, I can find it but may not be able to take the time until after CES.

Have a good show!
Ralph: I agree with everything that you have written above.

All distortion is not equal to the ears, and higher odd-order distortion sounds increasingly obnoxious.

Also, the character of the noise floor has a significant bearing on far into it the ear can hear. Completely random "soft" white noise, and the ear can hear deep into the noise floor. 20dB sounds about right, and correlates to what I have been told by Keith Johnson. But if there are harmonics, supply or signal-related rectification artifacts along for the ride, the ear's ability to hear into the noise floor stops much earlier.

If the designer doesn't pay attention to these areas, low-level detail is impaired while IMD or inharmonics typically creep into the noise and distortion products, and the result is a circuit that invariably does not sound natural or "believable".

Excellent post! And I hope that you have a good show, too.

kind regards, jonathan
not to change the subject too much , but in addition to ticka and pops whatwould cause those sharp "s" and "t" s too occur on some recordings . it can just appear on some recordings as it gets to the end of the record. is this a pre amp issue also ?
Panu21, it *can* be, but can also be a setup problem with the arm and cartridge. If the cartridge is not loaded properly, and is not set up correctly, it is conceivable that the additional RF energy that shows up at the end of the LP could bother some preamps.

However, it is far more likely to be an arm/cartridge setup issue.