Talk but not walk?


Hi Guys

This isn't meant to start a fight, but it is important to on lookers. As a qualifier, I have my own audio forum where we report on audio issues as we empirically test them. It helps us short cut on theories and developing methods of listening. We have a wide range of systems and they are all over the world adding their experiences to the mix. Some are engineers, some are artist and others are audiophiles both new and old. One question I am almost always asked while I am visiting other forums, from some of my members and also members of the forum I am visiting is, why do so many HEA hobbyist talk theory without any, or very limited, empirical testing or experience?

I have been around empirical testing labs since I was a kid, and one thing that is certain is, you can always tell if someone is talking without walking. Right now on this forum there are easily 20 threads going on where folks are talking theory and there is absolutely no doubt to any of us who have actually done the testing needed, that the guy talking has never done the actual empirical testing themselves. I've seen this happen with HEA reviewers and designers and a ton of hobbyist. My question is this, why?

You would think that this hobby would be about listening and experience, so why are there so many myths created and why, in this hobby in particular, do people claim they know something without ever experimenting or being part of a team of empirical science folks. It's not that hard to setup a real empirical testing ground, so why don't we see this happen?

I'm not asking for peoples credentials, and I'm not asking to be trolled, I'm simply asking why talk and not walk? In many ways HEA is on pause while the rest of audio innovation is moving forward. I'm also not asking you guys to defend HEA, we've all heard it been there done it. What I'm asking is a very simple question in a hobby that is suppose to be based on "doing", why fake it?

thanks, be polite

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net


128x128michaelgreenaudio

glupson

Can I be straight up with you. No one I know, including myself in this, has ever said they can’t hear the difference between the sounds of capacitors. If someone claims to be a HEA audiophile and makes these types of claims, there’s no point for someone like me to talk to them. Do you honestly think I should be spending my time talking to them? Keep in mind I may have a project sitting in front of me where I have 10 caps ready for me to listen to and give my reports on. Is that me being rude or choosing to be practical? Now when that person takes the time to learn the differences we actually then can have something meaningful to talk about. But if they believe there are no sonic differences it’s unproductive for them to be talking to me or I them. I should be spending my time discussing the differences with the guy who is on the same page as me.

Like with this tuning thing. I’m honestly not interested in talking to the guy who isn’t sure it works, when I have thousands of guys to talk to who are actually tuning. If you tell me glupson that you aren’t sure if tuning works, what’s wrong with me saying "come back to me when you know it does and we can tune together"? It makes zero sense for me to try to sell tuning when I am engaging with people who already tune. I can share tuning with someone, and so can other Tunees, but if someone doesn’t believe or hasn’t tried it’s a mute point. I’m not going to beg someone to make an adjustment when I can have fun with those making adjustments. Why would someone who doesn’t "do" even post on a thread talking about doing? I’m never going to convince you or amg or prof or whoever. The only one who convinces you is you.

What we have on this thread is people who do are doing and people who aren’t, aren’t. You can pretty much point to them after reading a couple of their posts. You can also read on here when someone is getting really upset. I can’t control someone else’s temper. That’s all on that individual. What I can do however is ignore them, because they’re really just looking for an argument. People who make arguments are usually people who defend their own lack of doing a topic. You see there is no arguments when one takes the time to "do". Someone says "oh I’ve done that and didn’t hear a difference", well why talk to me about it then? I’d rather just move on from that type of person. Why talk to someone about hearing if they can’t hear it?

You know glupson, Geoff is so right. It’s one of those hobbies that is always going to go further if we have the will to do so. Someone who comes up on a thread like this and says "I’m done" probably shouldn’t even be on this thread. No one ever arrives in this hobby as long as there is one more recording to listen to, or the chance to hear more of that recording. The term walking is an action.

glupson, let me ask you to do something. Find Grannyring's posts about the OP and read it again, giving it some thought. Grannyring's view of the OP is correct.

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net

Michael,

Your last post shows how arrogant and conceited you are. To assume that it's 'Michael's way or no way' shows your contempt for the other very knowledgeable Audiophile or enthusiast people in this world.

That is what was exhibited in your very first post as OP and that is why people other than my self questioned you. You have a very poor attitude towards those who just enjoy music for what it is, Your glib posts screak of sarcasm and know it all behaviour.

I for one will not be engaging you or your like any more. I would suggest you take a lesson in tuning up your smarmy attitude.

Goodbye Michael.

"You can tune a piano but you can't tuna fish" said by some rock band whose name escapes me at this moment (NRBQ?). LOL!

Your right amg, you should say goodbye if you think anyone here is not happy to see someone else enjoying their music. 

You and a few others that came looking for that fight by all means should leave, and you've been told that more than once.  Why be on a thread your unhappy with and don't understand amg?

You guys seriously have been trying to make something out of nothing from the very beginning and you get POed that no one wants to argue with you. If that makes me arrogant and conceited ..... well ok ..... I guess there's worse things to be. But shhhhh don't tell the Tunees cause they think I'm a fun guy, and nice. I'll tell you a little secret between you and me. These guys who have chimed in on this thread that tune, well they love tuning their systems. I know that's a horrible thing, but they just can't get enough of it. I mean think of their nerve. If they hear something they want to change with their sound, ok I gotta whisper this...they change it. Can you believe that...that's just nonsense. Imagine having a stereo system that you can tune....well it's...it's....un-hobby-ish of them.

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net