I must say that 10,000cst had a massive effect
TONEARM DAMPING : DAMPED OR NOT ? ? USELESS ? ? WELCOMED ? ?
Dear friends: This tonearm critical subject sometimes can be controversial for say the least. Some audiophiles swear for non damped tonearms as the FR designs or SAEC or even the SME 3012 that is not very well damped in stock original status.
Some other audiophiles likes good damped tonearms.
In other thread a gentleman posted:
" If a cartridge is properly matched to the tonearm damping is not required. " and even explained all what we know about the ideal resonance frequency range between tonearm and cartridge ( 8hz to 12hz. ). He refered to this when said: " properly matched to the tonearm ".
In that same thread that a Triplanar tonearm owner posted:
" This is the one thing about the Triplanar that I don't like. I never use the damping trough...... I imagine someone might have a use for it; I removed the troughs on my Triplanars; its nice to imagine that it sounds better for doing so. "
At the other side here it's a very well damped tonearm:
https://audiotraveler.wordpress.com/tag/townshend/
Now, after the LP is in the spining TT platter ( everything the same, including well matched cartridge/tonearm. ) the must critical issue is what happens once the cartridge stylus tip hits/track the LP grooves modulations.
The ideal is that those groove modulations can pass to the cartridge motor with out any additional kind of developed resonances/vibrations and that the transducer makes its job mantaining the delicated and sensible signal integrity that comes in those recorded groove modulations.
That is the ideal and could be utopic because all over the process/trip of the cartridge signal between the stylus tip ride and the output at the tonearm cable the signal suffers degradation ( resonances/vibrations/feedback ) mainly developed through all that " long trip " .
So, DAMPING IS NEED IT AT THE TONEARM/HEADSHELL SIDE OR NOT?
I'm trying to find out the " true " about and not looking if what we like it or not like it is rigth or not but what should be about and why of that " should be ".
I invite all of you analog lovers audiophiles to share your points of view in this critical analog audio subject. WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT?
Thank's in advance.
Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.
Some other audiophiles likes good damped tonearms.
In other thread a gentleman posted:
" If a cartridge is properly matched to the tonearm damping is not required. " and even explained all what we know about the ideal resonance frequency range between tonearm and cartridge ( 8hz to 12hz. ). He refered to this when said: " properly matched to the tonearm ".
In that same thread that a Triplanar tonearm owner posted:
" This is the one thing about the Triplanar that I don't like. I never use the damping trough...... I imagine someone might have a use for it; I removed the troughs on my Triplanars; its nice to imagine that it sounds better for doing so. "
At the other side here it's a very well damped tonearm:
https://audiotraveler.wordpress.com/tag/townshend/
Now, after the LP is in the spining TT platter ( everything the same, including well matched cartridge/tonearm. ) the must critical issue is what happens once the cartridge stylus tip hits/track the LP grooves modulations.
The ideal is that those groove modulations can pass to the cartridge motor with out any additional kind of developed resonances/vibrations and that the transducer makes its job mantaining the delicated and sensible signal integrity that comes in those recorded groove modulations.
That is the ideal and could be utopic because all over the process/trip of the cartridge signal between the stylus tip ride and the output at the tonearm cable the signal suffers degradation ( resonances/vibrations/feedback ) mainly developed through all that " long trip " .
So, DAMPING IS NEED IT AT THE TONEARM/HEADSHELL SIDE OR NOT?
I'm trying to find out the " true " about and not looking if what we like it or not like it is rigth or not but what should be about and why of that " should be ".
I invite all of you analog lovers audiophiles to share your points of view in this critical analog audio subject. WHAT DO YOU THINK ABOUT?
Thank's in advance.
Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,
R.
- ...
- 318 posts total
Dear friends :I already linked in this thread my caps thread, so you can read here the latest up-date about: https://forum.audiogon.com/discussions/best-harmless-signatureless-speakers-capacitors/post?postid=2... In the midrange crossover I use caps in parallel too, 4 of them and only in the band-pass and tweeter crossover filters use only one. Thank’s that in that forum ( techtalk. ) the experts in the subject ( some of them are DIY. ) gave me the normal audiophile advise to use some of the boutique caps and that no one of them gives me nothing different ( I’m not blame in any way to any one of them, as a fact I already appreciated their opinions. The best they can. ) I started to make a deep research by my self ( for moths and " thousands of tests with several models of Wima/Kemet/Vishay caps. Tests mainly in the midrange/tweeter crossover filters. ) through the internet and after I took in count that I had many Wima ( different models. ) caps that I changed in my electronics for many past years that I changed for in theory " better " caps type: more or less " boutique " type of caps. In that research I found out with no single doubt the very good reasons why Wima, Vishay and Kemet are the true Industry Standard devices and I mean in all kind of Industry from the aerospace, automotive, militar, medical, audio and the like and at the same time I found out and learned why audiophiles and some high-end audio items manufacturers use the " boutique " names that they used/choosed not with very good reasons but for the very " wrong " reasons with out knowing theirt bad caps selections: I was one of them as and audiophile/manufacturer. In my case my mistake/error was not made comparisons between the " boutique " caps and the way humble Wima/Kemet. Nothing can compare against those Industry Standard caps, nothing at all ( at least not any " boutique " one. ). Some of you like to make some DIY up-grades in your systems and for you I urge to try these caps in electronics and speakers and you will find out that all those euphonic distortions you like it and that are developed in your system just disappers leaving the signal MUSIC just " untoachable "/alone. It’s a total extasis about and I mean it. At the begining you can experienced, as some audiophiles that do not like damping because the sound is lifeless/dullness and the like but the reality is exactly the latest @lohanimal experiences when at the first moment he thinked exist some " trouble " with the stage performance and bass but latter on he posted that that was not in that way but more music information with lower distortions and this is what you will find out with those caps: the true and only the true, you can’t deceit your self. You can lost nothing because at the end of those changes and after your brain/ears been accustom to if even this you don’t like it then always can come back at the same place where you started with. Anyway, I want it to share with all of you my caps discovery because the rewards are extremely high and worth to do it or at least try it. Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS, R: Btw, today I can listen my system at any SPL you can name it and imagine does not collapse and even very high SPLs my ears don't ask to go lower but even can " support " higher levels that are really dagerous for my ears. I never imagined that the female voice sshhhh was developed by the system or at least making it with higher SPL. |
@rauliruegas Max Townshend told me he will give a link to the 'White Paper' but for now have a look at this link: https://patents.justia.com/patent/4277070 |
Dear @lohanimal : Great, I think that all of us appreciated. The Cranfield Institute of Thechnology made a true deeep reasearch and measurements about rigth what @bdp24 and you posted, it's not just bla bla bla. Well, here and in other threads I posted " similar " way of thinking ( bla bla bla. ) on the whole necessity of tonearm/cartridge damping where several audiophiles first don't cares enough about and second don't makes to them " click " my empirical/common sense way of thinking, well maybe not only common sense but first hand experiences even with out scientific measurements. A critical issue in that patent information that again I always talked about is that every kind of developed noised and distortions at any frequency develops harmonics/overtones that modulates/colored all the frequency range and in that patent they remarks that the frequencies developed even been to low: 0.56-3hz its harmonics goes to 20hz. Damping puts at minimum that problem either that the damping trough stays at the front or back in the tonearm. That's why I always state that as better the room/system bass range quality level as better will be the whole room/system quality MUSIC reproduction. From here came my first hand experiences with a pair of powered subs that I shared through my subwoofer thread. So, a tonearm needs at least to be designed and builded choosing the materials not only by its rigidity/stifness but taking in count the necessity to be well damped even with out using the silicon oil trough. Well there are many things to comment on that patent and the damping benefitial effects and for me is a learning lesson that I hope could be that way for other audiophiles. I know that always exist the audiophiles that no matters what they are entilted to that horrendous: " that's how I like it " even if he choosed the " wrong " road. Regards and enjoy the MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS, R. |
- 318 posts total