$800 Cartridge Shootout and Upgrade Path

50% is on the record. It contains only vertical information, when it is stationary. The turntable provides all the time-domain information, as it spins the record under the stylus.

In addition to the time-domain issue, the turntable provides some other extremely important attributes, without the proper function thereof, the cartridge cannot work up to its capabilities. This would relate to the main bearing's ability to maintain stability in the lateral plane. If the main bearing allows movements to occur within it(from vibration or other sources), the platter can be moved microscopically laterally, and therefore influence the critical juncture of the record/stylus contact. The record information contains modulations on the order of angstrom measurement. If the main bearing allows the platter to move, even slightly laterally, this will cause some of the record information to pass under the stylus without deflecting it(therefore losing information), or cause the record information to pass under the stylus and deflecting it too much(therefore causing overmodulation). Both of these conditions cause our cartridge to not perform as intended, regardless of how great the cartridge is, or how perfectly it is matched to the arm. No turntable does this function perfectly, as yet. The better turntables will allow the cartridge/tonearm combination to perform at a better level, because they are presented with the record information from the groove in a more stable manner, both vertically, horizontally, and in the time domain. Without this proper stability of the record groove, no stylus/cartridge can work at its best, and therefore will perform at less than what was intended. To get the best information retrieval from any cartridge you select, the record groove must be passed under the stylus with the most stability possible, in all three planes: vertical, horizontal, and time-domain(speed). Then the tonearm and cartridge combination can begin to do their work properly. Without this, they will never even approach their potentials. And this is why the turntable must be considered primary in the order of importance in the analog chain. Notice I did not say that it is the only important thing. Simply that the foundation must be laid before the roof goes on.

Dear Artar1: Yes, you an me agree on these subjects. But after that answer from you, Twl post:"According to the "rules of analog" the TT is the most important part, then the tonearm, then the cartridge. You seem to have..." and three or four peoples follow him.
These " rules of analog " are not only a wrong advise but an inexistent one.
Regards and enjoy the music.
Raul.

I've really enjoyed this thread & everyone's opinion's.

Raul,

Whether you're correct or others are correct, it feels like you're speaking from an ideal sense, not a practical sense. I see a real life issue I don't think you can solve with your reasoning; I don't think your logic can work for folks woking on a budget up to $5K (and probably a much higher budget). A huge percentage of the folks here are on a budget & are trying to achieve the best possible music from a table, arm, cartridge, preamp, rack, interconnects, cleaining machine, and accessories, within a reasonable budget. It's tough to apply your "logic/argument" in this thread, I wouldn't have a chance do it within my budget.

Dear Raul, perhaps you can point out to me how a cartridge can retrieve information from the groove, if the turntable allows enough movement in the platter to allow the information modulations to pass undeflected under the stylus, or to overmodulate the stylus? This is, of course, bearing in mind that there are modulations in the groove that are on the order of a millionth of an inch, and the movement tolerances in main bearings(even with the oil in them) are about one thousandth, or even one ten-thousandth at best.

Also, perhaps you can explain to me how a cartridge can make the speed correct, and provide proper time-domain and frequency information? Bearing in mind, of course, that the cartridge cannot even hope to affect these parameters, no matter how good it is.

Then, please explain how all turntables are acceptable in this regard, so that it matters not which turntable is used? Because if I've been going for all these years without knowing about a cartridge that can overcome the errors of a turntable, I need to be educated on that right now.

I'm sorry that you don't agree with my position. I will be happy to allow you to enlighten me about the errors of my ways.

And, by the way, I do agree that the tonearm and cartridge are very important factors as well, and I do not minimize their importance in the signal chain. I only point out that the cartridge can only transduce what it reads, and and the arm can only hold it properly over the groove, so that the turntable can feed the information to the cartridge effectively. They work as a team, and if the turntable "drops the ball" and lets the groove be the slightest bit unstable in any plane, the cartridge will never read some of that information correctly, and it will be lost or changed. The turntable provides the environment for the cartridge to work. If the environment is poor, the cartridge cannot make up for it. That is why I say what I do. Not to argue just for argument's sake.

Also, I simply stated my position and the reasons and even gave a little test that people could do to verify, and placed no attack at you during my discussion. However, you have decided to take it upon yourself to say that I am wrong, and implied that I am misleading the members of this forum. That is not appreciated.

TWL is back to his old self...WOW!!!