Agear,
The less said about Gary's choices of expression in the prior inconsequential imbroglio the better. But there is a difference in civility of discussion between me declining to endorse Gary's amplification and cable choices (which is what he seemed to want) and his langugage, tone and the shop-worn "Ford Focus" analogy. I did plainly write several times that I had no quarrel with him believing his choices were right for him, and that it shouldn't matter to him what I think. My entire reason for debating the point was to refute the idea that buying an exceptional speaker like Definition 4 mandates a subsequent massive investment in state-of-the-art gear to realize their potential. That's a pernicious notion, IMO, that I resist no matter the brands involved.
On the matter of a Zu owner who auditioned Audion gear on my advice: I don't know who you are referring to nor the circumstances of their audition. There are only two people I know of in the US who actually bought Audion Black Shadow 845 monoblocks specifically, for Zu speakers. In one case, the gentleman was unhappy with very well regarded solid state amps many times the price of the $12,995/pr Audions. He bought the amps blind, on my advice, and his response was "this is the best sound I've ever heard from an amplifier" (I have the email). He did not keep them. The reason is, he is highly sensitive to and intolerant of noise in electronics. He doesn't even like to hear relays on turn-on. I had warned him as part of my recommendation that the Audions would not be noisy in an obvious sense but they would not be as quiet as his solid state amps, and if this was going to be a problem, we should consider other options. He wanted to try, having never owned a tube amp, let alone SET. Others who heard his system found the noise level of the Audion amps to be inconsequential, but it was his system, not theirs. He's now embarked on a search to get "that same Audion sound with solid state silence." So far, he's still searching and I'm searching with him.
In the second case, the Black Shadows are firmly ensconced in a two-systems household and the qualities of those amps are fully recognized and appreciated, with both Zu and two other brands of speakers. I know of several others in Europe and Latin America who bought these amps after reading my experience with them, and all of those owners are happy. Black Shadows, particularly tubed well, are not "overly colored." They do have middling SET noise (less than most, a little more than the quietest (Sophhia)) and while I plainly say that most push-pull tube and solid state amps will have greater bass discipline and precision, the Audion 845 produces well-defined bass that is convincing and easily within the realm of high-end sound. Still, others may disagree or simply prefer something else, and that's OK with me.
Phil
The less said about Gary's choices of expression in the prior inconsequential imbroglio the better. But there is a difference in civility of discussion between me declining to endorse Gary's amplification and cable choices (which is what he seemed to want) and his langugage, tone and the shop-worn "Ford Focus" analogy. I did plainly write several times that I had no quarrel with him believing his choices were right for him, and that it shouldn't matter to him what I think. My entire reason for debating the point was to refute the idea that buying an exceptional speaker like Definition 4 mandates a subsequent massive investment in state-of-the-art gear to realize their potential. That's a pernicious notion, IMO, that I resist no matter the brands involved.
On the matter of a Zu owner who auditioned Audion gear on my advice: I don't know who you are referring to nor the circumstances of their audition. There are only two people I know of in the US who actually bought Audion Black Shadow 845 monoblocks specifically, for Zu speakers. In one case, the gentleman was unhappy with very well regarded solid state amps many times the price of the $12,995/pr Audions. He bought the amps blind, on my advice, and his response was "this is the best sound I've ever heard from an amplifier" (I have the email). He did not keep them. The reason is, he is highly sensitive to and intolerant of noise in electronics. He doesn't even like to hear relays on turn-on. I had warned him as part of my recommendation that the Audions would not be noisy in an obvious sense but they would not be as quiet as his solid state amps, and if this was going to be a problem, we should consider other options. He wanted to try, having never owned a tube amp, let alone SET. Others who heard his system found the noise level of the Audion amps to be inconsequential, but it was his system, not theirs. He's now embarked on a search to get "that same Audion sound with solid state silence." So far, he's still searching and I'm searching with him.
In the second case, the Black Shadows are firmly ensconced in a two-systems household and the qualities of those amps are fully recognized and appreciated, with both Zu and two other brands of speakers. I know of several others in Europe and Latin America who bought these amps after reading my experience with them, and all of those owners are happy. Black Shadows, particularly tubed well, are not "overly colored." They do have middling SET noise (less than most, a little more than the quietest (Sophhia)) and while I plainly say that most push-pull tube and solid state amps will have greater bass discipline and precision, the Audion 845 produces well-defined bass that is convincing and easily within the realm of high-end sound. Still, others may disagree or simply prefer something else, and that's OK with me.
Phil