Audio Science Review = "The better the measurement, the better the sound" philosophy

@laoman

I don’t know if you are stupid, are being deliberately obtuse, or cannot comprehend written English.

Do you think insults are really necessary?

Is it possible you maybe didn’t understand the point of what I wrote, rather then me being an idiot?

I wrote that I had no idea of the cost of or the Dac to which I was listening. I discarded those I disliked and purchased the best sounding Dac in the price range I could afford.

Yes. I know.

The point was that you wrote that the folks on ASR said you were "wrong" about the shrillness of the DAC, but that you wouldn’t countenance this because "You heard what you heard."

The point was...it really is possible the DAC really wasn’t producing any shrillness and that you were imagining it (a bias listening effect). It is actually possible the ASR guys were right. It’s possible that JUST LIKE MY EXAMPLE WITH MY SERVER, where I felt like I was hearing brightness/brittleness in the highs, but I was imagining it, you too may have been imagining it.

Blind testing can be one way to remove variables, like our biases.

It could also possibly be that you were NOT imagining the difference. But given the state of the art in DACs, and Topping’s reputation for well designed DACs, it should raise some red flags if someone says "this sounded shrill." I personally would, as in the case of my music server, want to rule out imagination first.

Because we really, really can imagine these things easily. And no it doesn’t matter whether you like the most expensive DAC or the least expensive. Our bias works simply by listening for differences (and even when we aren’t deliberately listening for differences).

This, yet again, goes to show how hard it is to discuss these things with someone who has never actually put their ears and biases to the test in blind testing. It’s humbling...and educational...but some will refuse to even consider the idea.

It's sort of like having had hearing tests performed by audiologists that show you can't hear over 20kHz, and coming back to a group of people who absolutely insist they can hear up to 30 kHz, but never put that to an actual test in an audiogram (audiograms are a form of blind testing), and dismiss the expertise of audiologists or anyone who has actually taken the test.   Sometimes you don't know what you don't know....

@prof I don’t really find it hard to acknowledge when someone has expertise that I lack. Well, I believe I have that expertise in listening that you may lack. Other posters find some of your statements so unusual that they cannot respond. I’m sorry that you lack my capabilities after 50+ years hearing high end audio to denote something that is superior from that which is inferior, and I don’t mean on a subtle basis. Dramatic to me is much more than most high end reviewers commonly allocate to something new in the marketplace to sell. I’ve been fooled by subtle differences and mostly avoided costly purchasing errors. I don’t need test measurements to prove my listening results when a DRAMATIC (and positive) change is heard. However, to justify my own results, I have two golden ear friends and other friends and family to listen and approve or disapprove the change. When it is a subtle change, I can get a mixed review, sometimes it’s worse. When it is a dramatic improvement, I only receive accolades. Since I moved into my custom listening room, accolades are the typical reaction-listeners don’t want to leave. Who leaves the last spoonful of gelato in the can without finishing?

Your post is nonsensical. I heard 8 Dacs. 1 sounded shrill in the MR, 7 did not. 2 others did not appeal. I quite liked 5.How cn you say I am wrong when I compared 8?

@fleschler 

Yet again...your replies are just exemplifying all my arguments for me.

Every reply is based on your own infallible hearing.  No other evidence need apply. 

And if for instance I didn't hear a difference between some tweak or cable where you thought you heard a difference, it could never be that I'm hearing what is real and you are wrong.  It must always be you are right.   And since you leave no way at all of adjudicating such questions, or learning if you are wrong, the only retort you leave yourself is to Lord it over anyone who disagrees  - as you are claiming...with zero evidence... to have superior hearing capabilities to me.

Let's see, how plausible is this brag?

Well, I've been an audiophile obsessed with sound for most of my 58 years.  Been a musician too.  I've been obsessed with live vs reproduced sound for so long I've done recordings and comparisons of live vs reproduced.  I have been so obsessed with sound that it became my livelihood - I work in pro sound post production doing sound for film and TV.  I am typically balancing and mixing the audio of up to 60 tracks at a time. I am manipulating sound all day long down to the finest nuance, literally matching the "air tone" of different rooms.  I guarantee you would not be able to pick out many of the things I can pick out in tracks.

I've heard countless super high end systems. I've been an audio reviewer, and have had friends in the industry for decades, still hearing lots of the best of the best stuff. (My friend's system is currently cabled up with about $50,000...just for the cabling!).  My reviewer friends call me to listen because they trust my ears to hear things they will miss.  Etc etc.

But...nope...you have somehow diagnosed that I must have cloth ears compared to your "capabilities."

Well, anyone can claim "capabilities."  I can claim to hear angels singing in the background on Kind Of Blue.  Oh, you can't hear them?  Poor you...you must lack my "capabilities."  I can say that stuff all I want to puff myself up and lord it over you.  Except you'd immediately recognize I haven't given an ounce of evidence for my brag.  So we'd be even ;-)

I've actually been willing to truly put my ears to the test - to see when I can hear differences WITHOUT the knowledge of what I'm hearing.  Apparently this is experience you lack.   And so long as you continue to lack this experience of really putting your claims to a test where you might fail,   then I'm sorry, the claims fail to impress.