Elberoth2,
I think this will be the same outcome in my case. I live in a remote area and it took weeks for me to to have it shipped over and to arrange pick-up. The seller is not interested at all in hearing the reason for this delay -- of course. If he hears it then he will have to respond to the issues -- item damaged on arrival -- poor packaging, which he denies -- and item tampered with -- back removed and improperly replaced -- for who knows what reason. He actually did respond to the latter point -- by claiming the shipper must have tampered with it !! My only recourse may be to try to post the details on the forum. |
Sabai, post the details, and I hope you used paypal and put in a claim. I would not buy a thing from anyone on here that are making excuses for an item being old, shipped 20X, old original boxes etc. Those people are irresponsible sellers with no ethics or just trying to get rid of junk at the expense of someone else. Conveyor belts travel at 25 mph so you need to double box even if using original packaging and re-enforce the inside and outside of the inner box on all sides top and bottom. |
I have so often commented about UPS, but will reiterate. I cannot imagine how they stay in business. They are more expensive that FedEx Ground and only note the "shock in their system" to account for damage done in their shipping.
This case really sounds like seller's incompetence in packing, however. I certainly have experienced this. Once when I still used UPS, I went out to their office to pick up a turntable. I took one look at the package with holes and open flaps and refused it. I am not sure that is even an option anymore. The seller was outraged. I told him to learn to pack. |
This is turning into an excellent thread to help newer members understand the risks associated with buying and selling online, and steps they can take to avoid problems. The collective experience here is impressive. Unfortunately, we are mostly "preaching to the choir," since the folks on this thread are not the ones causing the problems. IMO, the collective quotes below are priceless as a guide to staying out of trouble when buying and selling on this site; I routinely take hours to carefully pack and also to document the entire process with digital pics so if there are any issues with shipping I have good documentation. If you read my feedback it reflects the extra effort I take. It is the sellers obligation to properly package all items to withstand the stresses of shipping. A little extra thought and effort, plus a few dollars in extra shipping materials, could have prevented all of this hassle. I go out of my way to OVER package and make sure the item will arrive in perfect shape.
If you must use foam peanuts, the ONLY appropriate place is between the two boxes. I place high value on original manufacturer packaging, yes it adds to the buying cost, but it's worth it. If you tried to save some dough by buying something cheaper that doesn't have all of it's original packaging....well, you learned the hard way. I do not accept damaged items. If it's well packed in original shipping container and damage occurs, the seller should be able to collect on the insurance. DO NOT ship it back without contacting the seller, or the insurance he purchased would become invalid. The buyer needs to have some responsibility here. I think they need to thoroughly inspect the item within 48 hours of delivery. I usually look for items with original packaging and members with excellent feedback to help eliminate this issue. When i ship i make certain the item can be used as a football in a really ROUGH game, or dropped 20 feet. Because both have happened to stuff i got. And yeah the idiots who stick a heavy item in a box of loose peanuts wins the idiot award every time. Best for the buyer to confirm details of how gear will be shipped with the seller beforehand just to be sure. I put fragile labels everywhere, with heavy insurance, things get thrown harder. I witnessed it numerous times from the conveyors, the trucks, to the doorstep. Pack well or pay later. The buyer has to assume some liability in this transaction and checking the gear out promptly should be expected. UPS generally only pays damage claims on electronics if the item is shipped in the manufacturers boxes and uses all he manufacturers packing materials. So, any buy is risky unless picked up and the seller demo's the item before your cash is in his hand. If I do not have the original packing materials I pay FedEx or UPS to pack the items in order that if I need to place a claim they can't claim that the item was improperly packed. there is nothing wrong with the buyer taking an interest in how an item is going be packaged, especially something heavy, big, and/or fragile. never ship big speakers solely in the manufacturer's packaging. Put them on a pallet and have them trucked. It's both parties responsibility but the buyer is the one most likely to suffer in the case of a problem, so a smart buyer will make sure everything is in line with the seller to best assure safe shipping and perhaps insurance before the item is shipped, ideally before even paid for. If a seller would not cooperate with me on this, then I would look for another seller. You'd have to more than a few screws loose if you just stick something haphazardly in a box and send it on its merry way. The bottom line is that the buyer does have to take some responsibility in the transaction. You gotta do your own homework or be prepared to gamble a bit. Audiogon terms clearly state it's the sellers responsibility to get the item to you in the condition advertised. I've learned through bitter experience not to take pp funded via a credit card. The seller has NO PROTECTION. You don't even get the gear back. in fairness, weird stuff does happen in shipping--i.e. meticulously packaged gear from reputable sellers which arrives mysteriously broken. I think some of these problems should just be looked at as part of the discount inherent in buying used equipment. If you're not buying from professionals, then you shouldn't expect professional level service. At best you should expect well intentioned, talented amateur level quality. It's important to remember that even for simple tasks repetition leads to increased competence. I will caution that original packing is not always all its cracked up to be, esp if:
1. Its old.
2. It's been shipped back and forth across the country 20X
3. It's been left in a damp basement and the corrugated has started to soften up. As a practical matter as part of negotiation include details of your expectations about shipping. I feel little sympathy for those who try to save extra money by buying items without proper packaging who later get a shipping *surprise*. Cheaper is not always the best way to go. In summary, as a buyer it is best to; 1.Buy from experienced sellers, or accept the potential for additional risks, 2.Communicate directly with the seller and take an active role in how your new item will be packaged and shipped, and 3.Be available to inspect the item upon arrival and promptly contact the seller if there are problems. |
When buying or selling are we able to communicate directly without having to "publicly post" our email or private number for the world to see?
Ever since the web format changed it's not possible, which is really dumb if you ask me. |
