cartridge output level

thanks, Cptaz. 'twer nuttin'. ;-)

Marco (cptaz): what I meant is that, with the stated gain of 63dB, you'll get a "reference" 0,8?V at the output of yr phono. As you & Rlawry correctly note, I totally confused the issue... sorry guys.
In fact, if yr preamp sees ~0,9v fm the phono compared to the usual ~2V fm the cdp, the difference is indeed considerable (~+7dB)...

As noted above by Rlawry, More efficient speakers might be needed with your setup.. I am not sure of the efficiency on those triangles, however I can tell you this... My system has 60 db phono stage, with 15 db line stage, and a .45mV cartridge. And with 101 db speakers and only 20 watt amps, well it sounds like 2000 watts pumping at only 10 o'clock on the volume knob. I have heard my rig with 90 to 93 db speakers and I can tell you that I needed to crank up to nearly 3 o'clock in moving magnet mode with a different cart. and with this cart in MC up to 12 o'clock just to get sound going good.. No matter what you are forcing the tubes to be exposed to high gain and hum at some point regardless how good the tubes are.

So speakers can make a huge difference, #1 no matter what tube you use none will be silent in most phono amps up past 12 o'clock anyway so not bringing the gain that high in the first place via more efficient speakers will help solve that problem, cause with a 26 db line stage also backing them, Tubes of a slightly quieter variety might help, but with that much gain none will be that quiet from what I have heard.

How do you feel about the digital through your system? Do you feel its a bit pushed too when you want to get gain cranking? Cause that should be a bit effected as well if you speakers are just not juiced enough by the rig. Otherwise I say yes your easiest way out would be to get a new high output cart. But to really solve it and keep the better .45mV cart. might take some speakers.

Hi Gregm, ok now I understand, it totally makes sense, it's those 7 dB that make me turn the volume so high.
Hi Undertow, let's see, my triangles are 93 dB and my amps are 50 watts, I think those 8 dB difference on speakers outweight the 30 watt difference on the amps, so that makes sense too. I have to say though, that with digital I'm totally happy with the volume at 12 o'clock, I can't go beyond 1, and that's an area that, even when the phono input is selected, is pretty quiet. So, while I still want to try some more tube rolling, looks like one day I'm gonna have to get a new cart, one with a higher output that won't make me miss the colibri. Options are:
-Another colibri @ 0.65 mv, would those be enough?
-A Shelter 9000 (0.6 mv) or Air Tight PC1 (0.6 mv) same as above
-A Clearaudio Titanium (0.8 mv)
-You name it
Thank you all,
Marco

Marco

let's see, my triangles are 93 dB and my amps are 50 watts

So, if you get 93dB/ 1watt, you should get an extra ~17dB out of those amps before clipping -- which means that a 1kHz sine can be reproduced to ~120dB spl with yr spkrs... I doubt you listen to sine waves, though:)

Going fm 0,45mv to 0,65 will make ~3dB difference. The Titanium should fare better in this respect (amplitude) with ~5dB.
Actually the Tita is very nice for the money -- I used one for a while on loan fm a dealer. However, there used to be s/thing strange with the suspension on certain samples -- it would "soften" considerably & the cartridge tracked really low... don't know if it's a problem or part of the engineering, and anyway this never happened with the one I used.