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  3. 149050-1604

Computer to DAC Streamer

I am looking to get a digital-to-digital streamer for my new office system. I currently have a Sonare microRendu and that unit will move to another room once my new office system is built up. I also use ROON. I was originally considering getting a DAC with Ethernet streaming built-in but I may require a DAC with DSP and those DACs do not have this feature. I should add that the Linn SELEKT DSM streamer/DAC has Ethernet streaming and DSP but lacks the analog inputs I need (it also sounds excellent).

It has been suggested to me to buy an Innous streamer to get my music across to the DAC. However, I am trying to understand why these products are better than my current noisy computer combined with the micrRendu digital-to-digital type products. Anybody done a comparison? Is it because of noise on the Ethernet wire polluting the DAC?

http://innuos.com/en

In no particular order the following streamers have have come up in my research as being better than the microRendu I currently own (I have not heard these) :

Simaudio Mind2
https://simaudio.com/en/product/mind2-network-player/

Sonare Signiture Rendu
http://www.sonore.us/Signature-Rendu-SE.html

Auralic G2 Aeris
https://us.auralic.com/products/aries-g2

I am interested in the feedback or thought process of people who were making the same streamer decision as me. What did you guys end up getting or looking to get? I know there are a lot of lower costs alternatives and I am open to anything that will take my to the top tier sound level.

My preamp/DAC choice is looking like it will be the Anthem STR.
yyzsantabarbara
yyzsantabarbara OP
4,917 posts
 
@mrdon The reason I am looking for something even better than the microRendu (a very good unit) for the office is that some of the components will eventually make it’s way to the downstairs main system. I am not able to use the downstairs room yet because my toddler uses it for his play room. However, life is short and I don’t mind building my main system via the office.

@rbstehno The setup you have described is similar to what I have but I am using Sonare products to server as my ROON endpoints. I have the Sonare microRendu and a SonicOrbiter (previously used in a now sold system). I do not have to have my music in my office computer. I could move it the 1 of many servers I have running in other rooms of my house. My cheapo (actually a thowaway from an old job) office music computer is dead silent. What you are describing with your PS Audio + Bridge is exactly the basis of my thread. I am asking why is a dedicated music server better than the digital-to-digital conversion that you and I are currently using. In your case it is mac-to-bridge for me PC-to-microRendu.


audiotroy's avatar
audiotroy
3,820 posts
 

This is an interesting discussion, however, we have done over the years quite a lot of testing with both computers and servers, which have included models from Aurender, Auralic, Naim, Baetis, modified Mac Minis, and PCs.

The concept of a server is that it is a dedicated device that can re-packet data without corruption caused by noise present in the data pathways of the device.

If you think that an ordinary computer even one in another room can sound as good as a dedicated server you are sorely mistaken.

We have tested over the years computers with external power supplies, both directly connected via USB and over Ethernet connections, and the sound quality was lacking


The idea of a dedicated server is to preserve the data’s integrity, a dedicated server uses in most cases a custom motherboard, custom usb and or Ethernet outputs, custom BIOS, a linear power supply, re-clocking circuity, shielding, power filtration, and other techniques designed to keep the data signals being sent to the dac pristine.


As per direct USB vs Ethernet connection it really depends on the dac some dacs will sound better via USB while others will sound better via Ethernet.


One interesting test we did was to run a high end streamer/dac directly into a network switch and play Tidal vs feeding the same dac via Ethernet from the Innous


The sound quality of the system was dramatically improved by going through the server which isolated the dacs/streamer from the networks’ noise and also re-packeted the data going to the dac.


The sound stage was dramatically wider, the noise floor was lower, tiny details became easier to hear and the sound quality of the dac became more organic, you would think that the direct path to the network would sound better it wasn’t even close.


The fact that many people find that a dedicated server sounds far better than any old remote computer even over the network is proof positive that a dedicated server makes digital sound better.


As per the Auralic sounding better than an Innous that will be a matter of opinion, the Innous is the hottest server on the market all over Europe, and many people prefer the very analog like sound quality of the Zenith.


Dave and Troy

Audio Doctor NJ Innous dealers

yyzsantabarbara OP
4,917 posts
 
@audiotroy I appreciate the time you took to respond with your opinion as to WHY you think it is better to use a dedicated server. I do understand your argument. You also make another interesting point:

The fact that many people find that a dedicated server sounds far better than any old remote computer even over the network is proof positive that a dedicated server makes digital sound better.

That is the feedback or thought process I was inquiring about. How about some of you who have switched to the dedicated server side, care to chime in with your opinion?

rbstehno
1,472 posts
 
Audiotroy-are you saying that by using my Mac vs using a Linux dedicated music server that my Mac will corrupt data packets? Far from it. I’ve been in the IT industry for over 40 years and the cheapest computer will not corrupt data packets unless you have a failing device. If computers corrupt data packets then the stock market and all the banks better close up shop. 
Now I will say that hooking up a computer directly to a dac is foolish and flawed, no matter what computer you are using.
You and others always stress the need for a dedicated server. Others indicate that you need SSD for your music files. Far from it. I run Roon on my iMac streaming to multiple endpoints concurrently and the computer runs a little over idle. As for SSD, I worked for a SSD manufacturer producing enterprise grade SSD for million dollar servers and SSD is overkill for music. All computers read from disk/SSD into memory. You can read 1 song into memory within 1 or 2 rotations of a hard disk, clicked in milliseconds. Do you need your music faster than this?
i used to own an Auralic Aries which I thought was the best streamer at the time, and I had this directly attached to an external dac with the best usb cable. Got rid of all of that mess and went simple and my new setup sounds so much better.


audiotroy's avatar
audiotroy
3,820 posts
 
Rbsteno, do you think that because a computer is handling data that all data is the same?
A digital audio waveform is very different binary data packet than what you get in an moving a binary packet of data which is an encoded digital financial transaction for example.

As per SSD they do sound better. As per your Mac running Linux corrupting data absolutely, noise from the motherboard, cpu is riding along with the data packets going to the dac

You really need to talk to Nunio the lead designer of Innous who will give you insight into how digital data is not all the same and how it is easily corrupted.

As per the Aries steamers being good it wasn't, we has an original Aeries and it didnt sound all that good. Your conclusions are based on theory not on practice.
You can visit our shop, we have an ordinary Dell computer in one room, a Baetis Reference in another, an Innous Statement in that same room and an Innous Zenith in another.

We can show you that all of these devices do sound different even over the network.

Dave and TroyAudio Doctor NJ Innous dealers
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