Dealers hijacking the discussions

Jb why don’t you take your own advice. If you can’t determine a sales pitch from a conversation maybe you should.

The only reason I mentioned that was due to Grgr4blu starting it.

My posts are hardly off topic, if it wasn’t a certain person adding fuel to the fire there would be no need to rebutt anyone. If you haven’t guessed you are following and exhibiting the same bad behavior you accuse us of.

There is a difference between a sales pitch and a presentation or a discussion.

If you are discussing cars and you are a Ford guy try illustrating a story or creating an ancedotal reference which doesn’t mention the car or the make or the model is nearly impossible especially if you are trying to make a point in a conversation with a Chevy guy.

Here is a nice ancedolatal example, as mentioned before.

You had a guy question if a 25+ years old speaker brand X was better than brand Y and for the same money as brand Y you said why don’t you try brand Z that is also the same price and brand Z is also a highly rated product that you can have brand new and you might like it more than brand Y. Wow that is both stupid and confusing.

You like Grgr4blu think everything is a sales pitch guess what many times it isn’t and as mentioned before WE HAVE NOTHING TO GAIN MOST OF THE TIME!

We can not sell Brand X into dealer Z’s territory so if we are offering advice for some people to look at certain products because they might actually like them better or be saving money.

This is how we all learn about new product and new ideas, I have learned about new brands and products because sometimes a poster mentioned something I never heard about.

Did I immediaetly cry foul because someone mentioned some other product that was not mentioned in the original post. Grow up.

This dealer bashing is just wrong, many dealers here are actually offering real advice and many have nothing to gain either.

If I could tell you how many pictures of systems I have seen here that have huge setup errors it would boggle your mind.

That is what you learn in 30+ years of doing this for a profession.

I have turned on a few speaker designers and manufacturers to a few of the setup products we routinely use and they were shocked at just how much better we got the room sounding. They were open minded enough to let me show them and demonstrate them.

It is how open we all are to learning, and by the way JB all of life is selling from your first date to your job, to how you ingriatiate yourself with others.

It is doubtful you would ever or could ever benefit from someone like me who plays with a lot of different products and tests out lots of intersting tweeks some of which make a huge difference because you in your mind would be this guy is trying to get me.

Quite frankly I don’t want to be bothered you are  not worth me selling you anything. 

Dave owner
Audio Doctor NJ

Okay my supporters are fake how many fake Wilson supporters or Vandersteen supporters or Lamm or ARC of whatever.

The reality is these people are real, and have found out that I really do know my stuff, and have either been to my store or have actually talked with me. 

Grow up Grgr4blu, you have the maturity of a nat. Please patronize the dealer friends you have whom I am sure will sell you the most expensive gear that they have because they know what is best for you and why don;'t you have the balls to let me know who you really are or are you just the coward you exhibit here. 

There are dealers who give great advice then there are those who are just cheerleaders that try to quash real critiques from some audiophiles or past customers. I had an Ayon player some years ago and learned that there is a huge difference between being good and heavy advertising claiming to be good.  I talk to a dealer and said I wanted a little more warmth in the system and he just pushed the player on me and said that this would be fine. I was a young audiophile and didn’t know any better Ayon are not bad players but warm they are not! Had to learn quickly and after I complained about a problem with the remote the person came in on a forum and hi jacked the discussion. Just have to be careful!

As per Bo not even close. I have read his posts, I do talk about my products in a positive mannor, I also do mention they are a flavor and are very good products. All of my brands are major ones that have major industry accolades, wether or not you find brand x amp to be better than brand y is your taste and setup and matching components. 

When many major reviewers all say the same thing and you are constantly bashing that brand guess what you sound like Bo which is not credibile.

I have said that Wilson, Magico, Rockports Focals etc are all great product that have their sound. Personally I find Magicos boring, and Rockports to be more to my liking, but that is me. I have heard my share of bad Wilson setups as well as a few good ones, I have also heard YG sound mediocre as well as sounding great. 

If you read my posts I have stated that in certain ways some of my products are really good and may be better in certain areas, and may challange brand y which I am sure why some people are hurt they want to believe that their sacred product is better than all others. 

I have said time and time again, these products are tools and so can be moved in and out no big deal. If I find a better tool I move to that one it seems that certain people are threatend by a conversation.

1-Frankly, the issue with Audiotroy's posts are not his initial posts; it's the pissing contests that result when gpgr4blu decides to weigh in. If gpgr4blu would take a flyer, I guarantee Audiotroy wouldn't post ad infinitum defending his position. If Audiotroy were an exotic car dealer and could help potential consumers know the differences between say Porshes, Ferraris and Bugattis, he would be accepted as an asset to that group. In my view, he fills the same role here.
2-Unfortunately, due to the antagonistic nature of the dialogue, I need to be in the frame of mind to wade through the smoke to see the kernels of knowledge there. If these threads were moderated, a good moderator might defuse these multiple post wastes of space and only allow what is germane to the thread. 
3-The only thing I've learned from gpgr4blu is that he dislikes Audiotroy and some of the staff at Sound By Singer.  I'd wager he knows quite a bit about audio and I would welcome his spreading that information here vs his ad hominem attacks.