help me make sonos better

I should clarify that my DACs are very modest (as is the rest of my system), and that I have maybe a year's experience listening critically...that is to say, almost no experience at all in comparison with most who post here.

That said, it's my understanding that the benefits of the Cullen mod are only available at the digital outputs, so there's no way to really 'just' do the mod in lieu of adding a DAC. Gotta do both.

My thinking was that I'd like the source to be as good as it can be, and my first affordable experiment in that regard was with Cullen. I'd do it again for sure...although I'm thinking I should try the Empirical route next, if only so somebody could provide head-to-head comparison between the two. :-)

In the meanwhile, I'm free to take an incrementalist approach to swapping out other modest (~1k) DACs. But honestly, rIght now I'm trying to just chill out, listen to music, and grow into my ears. I know that my 'persistence of hearing' isn't yet accurate enough for me to discern extremely subtle differences when it takes 5 minutes to go from 'A' to 'B' while swapping out components in the chain.

Soundgasm... I certainly appreciate your comments and many times a "lack of experience" should be viewed by our readers as a "fresh approach". ;)

I realize that a DAC is still needed with the Sonos Mod, I was wondering if the MOD was needed with a better DAC since some of the better DAC's speak of "jitter reduction" circuitry. That may be just more marketing. Your approach of getting the source as clean as possible is certainly valid.

Sounds like you also feel that the $550 for a Sonos Mod was money well spent and the digital output is a significant improvement over an unmodded unit.

Thanks for your comments!

Could you comment on whether the addition of the Pace Car is a subtle or significant improvement in the sound quality.

I think the answer to this question is system-dependent. With highly resolving components, the addition of the Pace Car results in significant improvements. With moderately resolving components, I believe the improvements would be more subtle. You can read more about my experiences with the Pace car in a review I wrote.

Also, will a better DAC also reduce jitter?

It depends on the dac. Some do, some don't. Keep in mind that the "gold standard" for jitter reduction is a FIFO buffer, which discards the timing data altogether and relclocks the audio data with a high precision clock. This is the approach in the Pace Car. Many dac's that advertise their jitter reduction capabilities do not use a FIFO buffer, but use some other approach.

I do not have the breath of experience to generalize about how much better a FIFO buffer is than other possible approaches. I can say that my Meridian G68 uses PLL's and ASRC to reduce jitter, and even with that, the addition of the Pace Car resulted in significant improvements. Again, this assumes a certain level of resolution among the rest of the system's components.

I don't know the OP's system, but since he has not yet added an external dac to his Sonos, I am now thinking that the Pace Car might be overkill for him. In that case, a more sensible option might be the Cullen mods in combination with a moderately priced dac, and a good S/PDIF cable between them.

can i assume that the "OP" in byron's last response is the "Original Poster?". if so, dat would be me. here is my system:

cdp proceed
music server AudioRequest (model: Fusion Pro)
Pre BAT vk-5i
Amp (ss fall/winter) BAT vk-220 with bat pack
Amp (tube spring/summer) Cary six packs (mono pair)
Speakers sonus faber amanti
Cables/intercnts too advanced for my brain to remember the various brands but assume beyond decent in quality.

this "pace car" thing is something i'm going to research. please keep this conversation alive. learning more with each thread/response.

"I do not have the breath of experience to generalize..." I meant BREADTH of experience, not some strange metaphor involving breathing experiences. :)

Bob - Yes, OP is "original poster." As for your system, it is excellent, and far better than I was assuming in my previous post. In light of that, I would say that you would certainly hear significant improvements with the Pace Car. Whether it is your best option for getting the most from Sonos is another question. I think it depends on the dac you are considering. Given the amount of jitter inherent in Sonos, if I were you, I would want bulletproof jitter rejection in my dac. Short of that, I would seriously consider a reclocker like the Pace Car.