2. pc-audio
  3. 1168589271

Help with PC Audio Quality vs. CD

I hope someone with real experience can help out with this. I am having a hard time getting the same quality sound from a PC that I get from a CD player. I recently built a HTPC running Windows MCE and ripped all my cd's using lossless compression. I'm using an M-Aduio Audiophile 192 sound card and run a coax digital out of the PC to an external DAC and to my amps. It just sounds flat to me, not that it's not clear sounding, but the bass is weaker, I can hear a harshness that's not there if I run any old CD player to the DAC through the same connection. Has anyone else experienced this? I keep reading in this forum that people are saying how much better the computer transport is in theory, but I have yet to witness it. I heard that the Windows KMixer is the problem. I tried ASIO and Kernal Streaming drivers that are supposed to bypass this, and it sounds clearer, but still not as 3-dimentional and "black background" as a CD player (and I mean ANY cheap CD player, I've tried 3!)

Can someone out there with an external DAC try this and let me know their results? Use a DVD player or anything with a digital out... I don't get it. My soundcard alone cost 3 times as much as the cheap DVD player I tried and it doesn't sound as good. Anyone experience this or have any suggestions?

Here's my system so you can understand the sound I'm looking for.

I have an external MSB Link DAC III Full Nelson that I've been using for years and I really like the sound of it. I've been using a couple Sony CD changers and running them to a MSB Digital Director that will automatically switch between digital inputs, out to the DAC, then to a tube pre and tube power amp (modded dynaco ST70) and out to a pair of Monitor Audio GR10's. This system (with the right tubes) sounds so sweet to me. I'm into the huge soundstage, crisp, smooth sound - melty mid-range... you know, the analog tube sound!

I have experience in recording studios and work professionally in computers, so I have a good understanding of both, so don't be afraid to get technical with me. Any help would be greatly appreciated!!

Ben
thesauce

Showing 8 responses by gmood1

gmood1
1,251 posts
 
Ben I'll let you know what I think of the Trends unit when it arrives..hopefully this week. Right now I'm using a optical out directly to the Dac. I also use Foobar, SRC and the ASIO with Kernal Streaming . The sound is terrific now..it has me wondering how much better it can get. I think my unit has the newer software with the Kmixer fix.... not sure though.

Have you tried the Secret Rabbit code?..it helps the sound quite a bit!
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
I definitely prefer the PC to the cd player. I downloaded some HD music from Music Giant tonight. Man I haven't heard a CD that has the clarity, depth and dynamics of what I'm getting from these uncompressed recordings...simply amazing!!
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
As promised I am reporting on what the Trends audio UD-10 does or does not do. So far so good! If buying this unit..best to get the battery power supply. It makes quite a difference in my system and easily recognized. The same with the different digital outputs. I tried three of them..optical,coax and BNC. I prefer the BNC to the others.
The BNC was cleaner and clearer.

I noticed more snap with the battery supply running. My only real gripe is not being able to leave the unit plugged to the Converter while it charges. You have to unplug the supply in order to recharge the batteries.

For a $115 which includes shipping ...it is a no brainer if using PC direct. Is it the best USB converter?..I don't know..it is the best for me at the present. Connected to a good Dac and PC on the other end, I find it hard to imagine a one box player embarassing the combo.

I'm officially done with CD players or conventional transports as a whole..just doesn't make economical or convenience sense to me now.

I've watched some of you scream PC audio for over a year now..sorry I'm a little slow.;-)
I'm late to the party with no intentions of leaving it now! LOL

Good listening
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
I've been listening basically all day to this setup. Reconfiguring the Foobar and ASIO4all many times. I think now the unit sounds fantastic even without the battery pack. Adjusting the buffer to 128 without latency and using the ASIO4all as the primary output in the foobar menu sounds best too me. I set the SRC to 48khz upsampling.

I have no idea what the jitter level is in this UD-10. The website claims +/-10 ppm.I know it's bettter than my Superclock 3 player/transport by a mile.So it must be extremely low from what I'm hearing now. Going back through well known recordings. It makes the soundstage so well defined...like I've never heard before. It does this without glare or hardness.....No edginess either. It is though the lid was taken off. The notes just flow like I've never experienced! I urge anyone not on the PC train..try one of these units out if you already have a non USB DAC. It takes patience and time to find the right settings,but once you find them...Oh my GAWD!!

This is another one of those little Gems that's a true value best buy!
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
Ben I bought my unit from Buyoyo.com. The guy on agon is based in Canada. These units ship directly from Hong Kong. If their in stock and you go courier shipping. You'll have one within a few days. The UD-10 units are selling faster than the manufacture can produce them. Their always out of stock. I waited a month for mine..hopefully it will be faster for you.

I'm trying to find a 5 volt AC/DC 1.5 amp power supply converter so I can plug this unit into the wall. Not having much luck! I assume the sound would be about the same as using the batteries.
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
Pardales I wish I could help you with that.Can you use foobar? Just asking because I have no clue. The ASIO is definitely the way to go with the UD-10 using PC. The difference using the ASIO as the output is quite staggering! I tried using the DS:USB DAC and Primary sound driver as outputs. The ASIO was heads above them.

You may want to try that SRC also and see if it makes a difference.

I have a linear power supply on the way. Thanks to a very nice Agon member. This will eliminate the use of the battery supply. Try to find a AC/DC converter that will power the SB3..this same unit will power the UD-10. Make sure it uses a non switching power supply..not the basic wallwart.
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
That's a bummer Ben. Well I've plugged digital outputs up too mine... no problems at all. You are suppose to unplug the USB when plugging or unplugging the power supplies. I haven't seen anything about the DAC being turned off. I've had two DACS plugged up at the same time ..no problems. Maybe the unit was just defective?

If you think it sounded good off the USB power. You should hear it with the battery or linear power supply.

I hope the Agon dealer takes care of you. The unit is definitely worth the $90. You'll spend several thousand on a CDP to match it combined with a good DAC.
gmood1
1,251 posts
 
Yes I like the volume control too. I have this with my PC. The only problem is if the volume control is still enabled while listening to music. You haven't bypassed the windows audio sys.
It makes the sound stage a bit flat. The USB-Audio driver will completely take out the windows audio sys.

In order to get the best sound, the Kmixer has to be bypassed completely. You need the ASIO drivers to do that. You'll know when it's done because the volume control will have no effect.

The SB3 stands for Squeeze Box 3. You can go to Audio Circle and read about these little wireless units.

You need a 1.5 amp 5 volt power supply . Elpac use to make them.The same units discussed on AC will work with the UD-10.Go to AC an do a search on SB3 power supplies. You should get a lot of info to pop up. EBay could be a good place to look for this power supply. It is larger than the USB converter itself. lol
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