How does solo piano help you evaluate audio gear?

@hilde45 

I don’t think piano will be very useful unless you listen to a lot of piano, and already know some good piano music note for note. And there is plenty a Piano cannot tell you. I think this applies to all instruments/genres - there just isn’t one instrument at the apex (other, perhaps, than the human voice)

If you do listen to a lot of piano, then piano music critical for your auditioning - listen to the music you already know by heart, not someone else’s recommendation

I believe in auditioning with the music we listen to in our lives, and that we know intimately - that’s how we catch differences in reproduction. One captures range, tone, staging, pacing, dynamics, etc., in the track choices for the audition. I think very difficult to audition with unfamiliar music, or music chosen to check some box

I am sure Piano is very difficult to capture.  But if I listen to Janos Starker on Cello, “Mining for Gold’ by the Cowboy Junkies, and Song Remains the Same (or Ramble On) by Zep, that covers a lot of ground, as well - and it’s representative of what I listen to (I’ve got a ~15 track standard list, like most folks). I do love all Bach, and so get my piano there (but it’s his cello works on my audition list)

I do not feel you can use "one instrument" as an evaluator of gear.

Sound reproduction depends on engineering and design of the audio equipment itself.

I have heard realistic timbres of an instrument coming from one set of speakers that absolutely botched a plethora of other timbres.

So, most comments are correct about female voice, piano, and organ.

At my shop, we would close the door at the end of the day and take out our instruments and see if what we heard from the 50 or so speakers we sold was anywhere CLOSE to the live instruments.  Our competitor in Miami decided to become a recording person and worked very hard for years with excellent equipment to record and then playback a range of live performances in various venues.  Although he and I may disagree about some things, in MY shop the most accurate reproduction of the live instrument sounds and female voice (we had an electric piano, so unfortunately not able to do that, but our competitor spent months trying to get the most accurate piano recording possible--it ain't easy no matter WHAT OR WHO says it is, sorry.  If you think so, go try it and report back.  Otherwise, sorry, but you are ill -informed about the facts, which I know are not popular today as people tend to make up their own.

What we found after many, many sessions, was that if you wanted to hear exactly what you recorded, you needed SUPERB electronics and Magneplaners SET UP CORRECTLY.

SO, we sold a lot of Maggies and some super electronics--they are expensive and not for everyone.  Back then Audio Research was the winner, but things have progressed and I am sure there are others who are just as good today, although I would guess some of their stuff is still SOTA.  Certainly their pre-amps, which were always considered the best from the SP-3A1 on, still are at the top of the list for their better models.

Point is, boxes distort.  Such famous inventors as Bob Fulton and Mark Levinson tried to make hybrids with Quads, RTR's (electrostats), ribbons, huge woofers (Hartley 24's, etc) and so forth.  (Full disclosure: we built stands and cabs for some of Levinson's HQD System on contract.)  Phase issues were incorporated into mediocre speakers by B&O and better ones by Wilson and others, etc.

At the end of the listening process, side by side, none of these noble efforts eclipsed Maggies on piano, female voice, or organ for accuracy.  

Cheers!

@hilde45 Thanks for starting this thread.  You've gotten some good stuff here from the AG all-stars.  I think I know what I am doing on auditioning speakers but I'm going to be rereading this the next time I audition any equipment.  A couple of things I would add.

You have to know your own ears.  You have to know what kinds of aberrations that you can hear right away and what types of recordings can reveal those aberrations. 

For me, solo piano gets very quickly to about 80% of what I need to hear (or not hear) in an audition. I've been able to reject some pricey speakers 30 seconds into a piano recording.  It reveals quickly speaker problems that may take a while for me to discern using other music. For that reason, if I am auditioning in a brick and mortar setting my first recording is piano. Other people may do better with other types of music. Know your ears!

Massed strings has been mentioned.  To be sure, a speaker that gets this right is a keeper.  This is a very high hurdle.   It is what you get for 80K that you can't get for 10K.

A few more words on French Horn.  A good system, especially a tube based system, can impart a richness and fullness to the horn that will make you melt into a pool of mush in your chair.  It's hard to describe, other than to say I am convinced that is how French Horns sound in heaven.

Certainly, voice is an imperative, and speaker manufacturers know this.  It is a lower hurdle for the manufacturer.   There are plenty of speakers that are credible on voice that I would not be happy with in my system. 

@frogman -- thanks for the rec’s. Will try those.

@jonwatches1

I don’t think piano will be very useful unless you listen to a lot of piano, and already know some good piano music note for note. And there is plenty a Piano cannot tell you.

So, I have said a couple times I’m not using only piano. I repeat that point, for you, here. You’re clearly an outlier about the usefulness of piano, but I cannot adjudicate that. It’s free to try, and many people have said why it’s useful.

As for listening to piano music I know well -- if it’s not well recorded, it would seem I’d be better off with a new piece, well recorded.

@arro222
I do not feel you can use "one instrument" as an evaluator of gear.

Can you please read the thread? FFS.

@richopp
-it ain’t easy no matter WHAT OR WHO says it is, sorry. If you think so, go try it and report back. Otherwise, sorry, but you are ill -informed about the facts, which I know are not popular today as people tend to make up their own.

Um, who are you arguing against? In all caps, no less? I see you’re a Maggie dealer. And you’re pushing them. Noted.

@brownsfan I am going to focus on piano and french horn today. And I’ll keep my own ears in mind, so to speak. Some great recommendations on this list.