MC-MM-MI CARTRIDGES . DO YOU KNOW WHICH HAS BETTER QUALITY PERFORMANCE? REALLY?


Dear friends:The main subject of this thread is start a dialogue to find out the way we almost all think or be sure about the thread question :  " true " answer.

 

Many years ago I started the long Agon MM thread where several audiophiles/Agoners and from other audio net forums participated to confirm or to discover the MM/MI/IM/MF/HOMC world and many of us, me including, was and still are" surprised for what we found out in that " new " cartridge world that as today is dominated by the LOMC cartridges.

 

Through that long thread I posted several times the superiority of the MM/types of cartridges over the LOMC ones even that I owned top LOMC cartridge samples to compare with and I remember very clearly that I posted that the MM and the like cartridges had lower distortion levels and better frequency range quality performance than the LOMC cartridges.

 

In those times j.carr ( Lyra designer ) was very active in Agon and in that thread  I remember that he was truly emphatic  posting that my MM conclusion was not  true due that things on distortion cartridge levels in reality is the other way around: LOMC has lower distortion levels.

 

Well, he is not only a LOMC cartridge designer but an expert audiophile/MUSIC lover with a long long and diverse first hand experiences listening cartridges in top TT, top tonearms and top phono stages and listening not only LOMC cartridges but almost any kind of cartridges in his and other top room/systems.

 

I never touched again that subject in that thread and years or months latter the MM thread I started again to listening LOMC cartridges where my room/system overall was up-graded/dated to way superior quality performance levels than in the past and I posted somewhere that j.carr was just rigth: LOMC design were and are superior to the other MM type cartridges been vintage or today models.

 

I'm a MUSIC lover and I'm not " married " with any kind of audio items or audio technologies I'm married just with MUSIC and what can gives me the maximum enjoyment of that ( every kind )  MUSIC, even I'm not married with any of my opinions/ideas/specific way of thinking. Yes, I try hard to stay " always " UNBIASED other than MUSIC.

 

So, till today I followed listening to almost every kind of cartridges ( including field coil design. ) with almost every kind of tonearms and TTs and in the last 2 years my room/system quality performance levels were and is improved by several " stages " that permits me better MUSIC audio items judgements and different enjoyment levels in my system and other audio systems. Yes, I still usemy test audio items full comparison proccess using almost the same LP tracks every time and as always my true sound reference is Live MUSIC not other sound system reproduction.

 

I know that the main thread subject is way complicated and complex to achieve an unanimous conclusions due that exist a lot of inherent differences/advantages/unadvantages in cartridges even coming from the same manufacturer.

 

We all know that when we talk of a cartridge we are in reality talking of its cantilever buil material, stylus shape, tonearm used/TT, compliance, phono stage and the like and my " desire " is that we could concentrate in the cartridges  as an " isolated " audio item and that  any of our opinions when be posible  stay in the premise: " everything the same ".

 

My take here is to learn from all of you and that all of us try to learn in between each to other and not who is the winner but at the " end " every one of us will be a winner.

 

So, your posts are all truly appreciated and is a thread where any one can participates even if today is not any more his analog alternative or is a newcomer or heavily experienced gentleman. Be my guest and thank's in advance.

 

Regards and ENJOY THE MUSIC NOT DISTORTIONS,

R.

Ag insider logo xs@2xrauliruegas

I have tried to find value in this Thread but have not been introduced to anything that has got my attention, apart from the cost of TOTR MI Cart's, which won't suggest as being educational in relation to Audio as a means to create sound.

The Thread has caused myself to rethink a few things about my own contribution's to the Analog Section of this forum, so much that I can't but help sense, my repetitive covering of personal experiences had are seemingly mundane and not really a stimulus to encourage others who may look in to try something new.

For those who are looking in bit not contributing to the thread, I really hope something of value has been discovered from what has been read.

On that note, I will be taking a Hiatus from being a contributor to the Analog Section of Audiogon. 

To all I have interacted with on the Analog Section, all the best in your future endeavors.  

  

 

Btw,  even today we can find out with a little patience the ADC 26 through ( mainly ) ebay.

The ADC 26 is not exactly for any cartridge because the extreme compliance of 50cu that comes in that ADC design.

I think that all the cartridges ( any cartridge motor kind design. ) named here sooner or latter we can put our hands on it and is worth to try it.

When those vintage cartridges comes in good operation conditions you can be aware of its high quality performance levels and you can get for " penauts " prices.

I know that for several of you vintage is " forbidden " because we want the new ones but at the end: is it not the maximum MUSIC enjoyment through our LPs what we are looking for?

If yes, then new or vintage cartridges can satisfy that MUSIC maximum enjoyment

 

Don't you think? because in my audio life that's what I wa sand am always looking for but maybe that is only me and for me.

R.

@mijostyn : It’s not coincidence that the Denon DL1000A not only goes to 110khz but runs at only 0.7grs been a LOMC cartridge but its cantilever that’s a short one is made of amorphous Boron pipe. The Highphonic uses diamond short cantilever and very high compliance to runs at 0.9grs.

 

Btw, Technics uses a technical: chemical vapor deposition to manufacture its cartridges Boron pipe.

Top cartridges in those times normally came with effective moving mass in the range: 0.098-0.22. Usually. The Technics 20’5MK4 had 0.149 on that parameter.

 

Today we can’t find out any single cartridge with those kind of numbers or any LOMC cartridge that can runs not at 0.7grs-0.9 not even at 1.25grs

Today times are very good and in the past were truly great specially with cartridges/tonearms/TTs but not electronics. Today are great times in electronics and very good in speakers if not excellent.

 

R.

 

     This thread is so far removed from the original poster (OP) that I won't even try to bring this one back. I have 3 Rega turntables and after the 4th time switching out the spacers from my B880 tonearm, I braised the locking screws. I became disgusted with the Rega (control freak) way even though the Asia, Asia Pro and Apheta 3 I had use previously were auto synched to the table, I wanted to experience other MC offerings which required spacers.

     In any event, I decided to buy a Technics 1210 G and added several cartridges on different headshells including an AT33GTP/II MC (excellent), a Hana Shibata MC and a Denon 103R. I then added an Ortofon Black 2m (MM) to the mix and started doing some comparisons. 

     The least expensive cartridge in this lot is the Denon 103R, but at $600 it is open and breathes easy, especially for a conical stylus. The Ortofon Black 2M is probably among the best moving magnet designs I ha=ve ever heard but it lacks that high end my B & W Signature 702 S2s command. Don't get me wrong, in many systems, higher end moving coil cartridges are not a good value. My system is fairly high end and I invest more $$$ for cartridges to maximize the sound profile I am looking for. 

     On my Rega Planar 3 anniversary, I tried the Apheta 3 and realized that anything above the Ania Pro would not improve the sound. I then put the Exact 2 back on it and it performed well. Sounded within its boundaries. The Ania was a small upgrade from there, but in this mid-fi kit, (speakers are B & W 703 S2s), these carts were fine.

     Finally, we all hear distinctly and what may be too high in the treble, may be perfect for someone else. I prefer natural bass with a reasonable decay (I balance the 702 Sigs with a REL ST/9x)--my daughter, the disco queen feels the "bass" is too light. As I said to each his own. Bottom Line: our collective audiophile hobby has no price points, just the desire to appreciate music and seek the respective affordable way to attain one's maximum output.

 

     

Dear @mervo  : I don't know what you mean: " removed by the OP ", I did not.

 

You are totally right with your last sentences:

 

"  our collective audiophile hobby has no price points, just the desire to appreciate music and seek the respective affordable way to attain one's maximum output. "

 

That's the best each one of us can do. Thank's for share your opinion.

R.