People will recommend what they have heard. You. Red to expose yourself to as many speakers as possible. Look at those that are over your budget. Chances are you can find them used for less. Personally I think the Vandersteen ones and twos are a great sound and there are lots out there used. I have B & Ws which lacked bass added a used Vandersteen self powered woofer the 2WQ, which freed the amp from handling the bass Entire system sounded so much better. You might be able to keep the amp and the Elacs with a self powered subwoofer. Also consider your cables
Please Critique my Setup and Recommend Upgrade(s)
As a lifelong musician and former recording / pro audio engineer, this is my first foray into the world of HiFi and I could really use some advice and direction. Last week I bought the following setup for a dedicated listening room that is essentially a 13x13 square room on three sides with the area behind me extending back another 25 or so feet. There is a partial backwall about four feet wide but it is mostly open air behind me. Ceilings are 9' and I have GIK bass traps in all corners, early reflection points on the side walls, and panels overhead between speakers and listening position. Speakers are about 2 1/2 feet from back wall, 6 ft. apart, slightly toed in on cheap stands weighted down by cinder blocks.
1. 2017 VPI Scout Prime turntable with Ortofon Bronze
2. 2017 Rega Brio Integrated 50wpc Amp and Phono Stage
3. ELAC Uni-Fi UB5 Speakers
So far this setup certainly sounds good, but it isn't blowing me away either. At lower volumes the soundstage feels a little small and two-dimensional. At louder volumes the sound seems to fill the room more, thereby enhancing the soundstage and making the music feel more natural as opposed to coming from directly in front of me. The stereo imaging is okay, but I expected a little more stereo separation. Also, perhaps the speakers are still breaking in, but the ELACs don't seem to do the best job of presenting the music in a cohesive manner. It sounds like the frequency bands are a little disjointed.
Should I stick with the ELACs but consider a higher end integrated amp that can feed them a little more power like a Parasound Halo? Or should I nix the ELACs and invest in some more efficient and higher end loudspeakers,e.g. Devore, ATC, ProAc, etc...? Would I still get an audible improvement with these nicer and more efficient speakers if I stick with the Rega Brio, or do these high end speakers warrant a truly high end amp? I ask because I likely can't upgrade both speakers and amp at the same time.
I also considered the KEF LS50, but it seems like they are similar to the ELACs in that they are rather inefficient and need a powerful amp.
1. 2017 VPI Scout Prime turntable with Ortofon Bronze
2. 2017 Rega Brio Integrated 50wpc Amp and Phono Stage
3. ELAC Uni-Fi UB5 Speakers
So far this setup certainly sounds good, but it isn't blowing me away either. At lower volumes the soundstage feels a little small and two-dimensional. At louder volumes the sound seems to fill the room more, thereby enhancing the soundstage and making the music feel more natural as opposed to coming from directly in front of me. The stereo imaging is okay, but I expected a little more stereo separation. Also, perhaps the speakers are still breaking in, but the ELACs don't seem to do the best job of presenting the music in a cohesive manner. It sounds like the frequency bands are a little disjointed.
Should I stick with the ELACs but consider a higher end integrated amp that can feed them a little more power like a Parasound Halo? Or should I nix the ELACs and invest in some more efficient and higher end loudspeakers,e.g. Devore, ATC, ProAc, etc...? Would I still get an audible improvement with these nicer and more efficient speakers if I stick with the Rega Brio, or do these high end speakers warrant a truly high end amp? I ask because I likely can't upgrade both speakers and amp at the same time.
I also considered the KEF LS50, but it seems like they are similar to the ELACs in that they are rather inefficient and need a powerful amp.
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- 73 posts total
We've upgraded many Debuts and Uni-Fis to ELAC's beautiful BS 403 bookshelf. It's $1000 in gloss black/white, and sounds considerably better than either one of the less expensive lines. If you can audition that particular one, that's what I'd recommend. I'd also remove all the treatment from the room. Get a baseline performance level that you're satisfied with just by playing with positioning of the speakers, then add the panels/traps if/when needed. cheers, alex |
Ok...the VPI Scout Prime with an Ortofon Bronze (I am assuming 2M series since the Rega is only MM loading) is your strongest component. I am wondering though, if you are limiting it by using the integrated phonostage of the Rega Brio. I'm not a big fan of integrated anything, but especially not for the phonostage. I'd maybe consider borrowing a proper separate phono pre-amp from your dealer. A good all-rounder is the Sutherland Insight. Music Direct sells them and gives you a generous 60-day return period should you not be happy with it. Speakers are so subjective; not only is their sound a consideration, but their style also should influence your decision. What looks good to me might not you and might not fit the rest of your decor. I'm a fan of Martin Logan electrostatic paneled speakers. They are not the most efficient and will get better the more power you throw at them. They are very fast and accurate and provide a nice sound stage, but they have compromises. Biggest one being there is a very narrow sweet spot for the listener. The only cone speakers I would consider ditching the Logans for are Tidal or Aerial Acoustics (that I have heard). But those are super expensive!!! Looking at the speaker selection offered at say, Music Direct, I think Sonus Faber has one of the better reputations. I've not heard them, but know the company is well respected. Focal also, but the ones sold at MD are their lowest end (I think). I'd look at Stereophile online and see what speakers they recommend in your price range. Here is a link: http://www.stereophile.com/content/recommended-components-2017-edition-loudspeakers#XA72TpL7A6pv5so2... Kind regards, Jason |
HOLY S#!T, that's a lot of advice in 4 days! This will be a drop in the bucket. +1 for waiting until the system burns in, unless there is a 30 no risk return or something. Starting with the best speakers is a well worn philosophy. In your case, however, the relatively low power of the Brio limits you. It won't be enough for the Vandersteen 2Ce, so it's already pushing you down to the 1Ci. So you've pretty much got to upgrade the integrated in order to broaden your speaker choice. One approach may be to buy something like a used 100 W Rotel as an interim. It would power almost any speaker your going to look at, you could probably get one for about $250, (and sell it for the same amount when your ready), and they sound really good for the money. Something like a RA-1070 or even a receiver like the Rx-1052 (go with something like a NAD if you want a warmer sound) Shop for the speakers you really like, and then an integrated that brings out their best. Also, you only mention the VPI/2M bronze as a source. The cartridge may take longer than the rest of the system to break in. Do you have a CD player? Is it giving you the same issues as the LPs? Best of luck. |
Thanks again guys, really appreciate the advice!!! As for the Rega Brio, I agree that it is a limiter at 50wpc for many speakers, but is it fair to say that upgrading to more efficient speakers would be as helpful as buying a more powerful amp, if not more? I'm still new to speaker sensitivity and impedance, but wouldn't an upgrade from 85db to 91+ be the equivalent of running a monster amp with the ELACs? I would guess I'm around 24 hours of music on the system, so I suppose I'm still in the burn-in phase with everything...again, the system doesn't sound bad by any stretch, but I'm willing to try a different amp and/or loudspeaker to make it really shine. |
- 73 posts total