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  3. 1345927301

Selling dispute. Please comment.

I recently sold a pair of mono amps and checked the box that indicated the original manual was included. I never use the manual for something like this and just assumed the manual was in the box as there were some various papers from the manufacturer in the boxes.

The buyer got the amps safely and they are in perfect condition as described. I shipped the same day the item sold. Unfortunately the manuals were not in the boxes the amps came in. These were the original boxes, but the manuals are not there according to the buyer.

I sent him the link to download the pdf of the manual. He is not happy with that. I offered to print a color double sided copy (on good stock) at Kinkos for $20 (at my expense) and ship that to him. He says that the original manual was promised and that I have to deliver that to him. And that he dervers two of them since the amps came in two separate boxes. He is threating to kill the deal and dispute with audiogon and paypal.

I admit that I'm in the wrong for mis-stating that the manuals were included. I will attempt to order the manuals from the manufacturer on Monday, but I don't know that the manufacturer will provide them even if I pay for them.

I'd appreciate comments regarding this problem. Thank you.
jaxwired
onhwy61's avatar
onhwy61
5,215 posts
 
Is it possible that the buyer knew the amps could not come with original manuals and that demanding them is some form of shakedown scam? If he had done his research how could he not have known about the manuals?
gwoelfl
4 posts
 
I would side with buyer if original manuals would have been printed material. I tend to pay more for used gear if original manuals are included because I assume ower(s) took better care of the equipment; original manuals for vintage gear can fetch relatively high prices on eBay - I paid $50 plus shipping for an original manual for a vintage high end tube unit.

This is even more important for original boxes and packing for the same reason, AND also because many manufacturers require gear to be shipped in original packaging for when shipping for warranty and other repairs. I paid over $60 for Audio Research box and packing when I had to send in a used unit for repairs. The toy analogy does NOT hold.

The seller should have CHECKED what was in the envelopes when listing - seller was hasty constructing the listing. None of us would accept high quality copies of missing manuals when we purchase new gear, therefore copies are not the same.

Of course the seller invested time to correct his MISTAKE and lucked out that original paperwork was not "printed" material. Of course the copies would have the same information but is that the only purpose? If buyer decides to sell the gear to me in the future, he will get more for it.

In summary, to a buyer/collector, original manuals can be important. Copies are not really valuable these days given the internet; anyone can have a high quality copy made for $10 to $20.

I DO NOT THINK IT IS FAIR FOR THE SELLER TO DETERMINE WHAT IS UNIMPORTANT TO THE BUYER.

I was not the buyer in this case, the two Audiogon purchases I made were great! If Audiogon FIXES there site I may make further purchases (got that in!).
Ag insider logo xs@2x
drubin
3,274 posts
 
If Audiogon FIXES there site I may make further purchases (got that in!).
If I may ask, what needs fixing?
jaxwired OP
232 posts
 
My next ad will say:

"No original paperwork of any kind included"

Also

"Condition of item cosmetically flawed. DO NOT purchase if you want a like new item. See pictures for condition."

I feel confident this will have zero impact on my ability to sell. Maybe it will keep the nut jobs away.
rx8man's avatar
rx8man
1,481 posts
 
Way to go Jax, nothing to fret about, it's a shame you have to cover yer butt in unexpected areas.
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