2. music
  3. 182335-171283

Solving the "complex music problem"?

I have noticed that, regardless of the system, simple music (i.e. music with only a few sounds at the same time, such as a solo instrument) sounds way better than what I'll call here "complex music", meaning music like symphony that has a lot of instruments all playing different sounds at the same time. I'm assuming that this is an inherent problem for audio equipment. In a live symphony, you might have, say, 15 different unique instruments (i.e. counting all the violins as 1 unique instrument), each of which is vibrating in a different way; but in a speaker, each driver might be trying to reproduce 10 of those sounds at the same time. So each driver is a single physical object trying to vibrate in 10 different ways at the same time. The result is that the music sounds muddy, all the different parts blend together and you lose a lot of the detail.

I have a number of questions about this that I'm hoping all you experts can help me with.

1. Is there an established name or term for this issue? 

2. Do you think my diagnosis of the problem above is correct? Or is something else going on?

3. Although this is always a problem, it's a much bigger problem on some systems than others. Are there some types of components, or some brands, that are particularly good (or bad) when it comes to this issue?

4. To what extent is this issue related to the components you have as compared to speaker placement and room acoustics?

5. To me, this is a huge issue. But I don't see it discussed all that often. Why do you think that is? Or, perhaps, it is being discussed all the time, but people are using a term I don't recognize? (hence question 1).  

 

Full disclosure, I asked a related question under the heading "need amp recommendations for more separation of instruments" and got a lot of super helpful responses. I'm very grateful to everyone who took the time to respond there. That discussion was focused on a solution to my particular problem. Here I'm hoping to have a more general discussion of the issue. I know it's bad form to post the same question twice, but in my mind, this is a significantly different question. Thanks.

ahuvia
subsystemtechnology
1 posts
 

Room acoustics, Room acoustics, and again Room acoustics is the element that is most neglected in the home Hi-Fi environment.

Same system in acoustically treated room, and the very same room that you remove acoustical elements sounds way, way different.

Instantly you will put back your acoustical elements back no matter how ugly/nice looking they are.

Today you can find on internet tube bass trap units that are not ugly and dark as they where before, but they are more like room effective decorative element in wide range of colors and shapes that can fit in any space, and of course to satisfied woman's perspective.

 

kota1
2,706 posts
 

@subsystemtechnology , congrats on your first post and welcome to the forum. I agree with you 100%. When you have time could you post your system in your profile? Always interesting to compare. thx.

wolf_garcia
6,738 posts
 

I use horn speakers pointed right at my earballs when I'm in my "sweet spot" chair and really only the bass is reflecting off of anything, but that's what bass does. I adjust the subs if they get too much or too little...rarely. Then if I sit elsewhere in the tall ceilinged largish room it sounds like great music is being played by musicians in that end of the room, and everything can be heard. Everything. If your system doesn't do that, well, I don't care. I don't even know you...get away from me...grumpy old man alert!

frogman
7,487 posts
 

My feeling as well.  I may have opinions about pin point imaging, but frankly it is nowhere near the top of my list of prioritizes when listening.  Most of my listening is done outside the sweet spot.  I focus more on tonal issues and rhythmic coherence.  In fact, as fun as imaging can be when in the mood for ear candy, I find it can be a distraction from other things that are more important to me.  

alexberger
936 posts
 

IMHO for complex music good musical instruments and voices separation the most important component is amplifier.

Speakers and source are important too. But you can have a great CD player or vinyl setup and great speakers, good room acoustic and mediocre amplifier will make complex music sound congested. On another hand great amplifier with just decent speakers and source gives good complex music separation and such system will sound much better in general vs system described before.

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