Sound quality differences in streamers

In any case, i hope you leave yourself open to the possibility that the digital source of a server or a streamer is as vital and primary to a sound system, as a pre, an amp and speakers are.

@kevn 

Sadly, I am going to have to disappoint you. I am open to the possibility that a streamer can make a difference in sound quality, however I doubt that "vital" accurately represents it, and "primary" it ain’t.

I realize this statement puts me in the company of men who own Naim gear. I am mortified, but what’s a person going to do.

You mention elsewhere that you are a trained architect (I’ve never met untrained ones), so I’m going to guess that you have some passing familiarity with how stuff gets built. Like, you prep and stabilize your site, pour your foundation, erect your walls, etc. Same goes for building an audio system; there is a process involved, and a rational way to go about it. Sane people don’t build their systems around streamers any more than you build your buildings around sliding closet doors.

I am not denying the importance of closet doors, mind you; just that there is a right place for everything. 

Next up: why would a streamer that merely transports ones and zeros make a difference in sound quality? Is devinplombier insane? Stay tuned

O P here. I appreciate but certainly didn’t except this many responses on a subject which has been hashed over before. Thanks. I was this close to ordering the Volumio RIVO+ plus outboard power supply but because I am initially planning on WiFi connection only I read the RIVO suffers connectivity wise. I’ve read that the Cambridge EXN100 is quite capable with great results via WiFi. Still reading, still researching, still thinking —

@devinplombier 

Very interesting topic.  And I’m sure all will be shocked that I have a different view than @kevn  does as it relates to digital v analog.  I think perhaps a more apt analogy is as follows:

1) Reading the source - in the analog realm, everything starts with accurate reading of the music as described physically in the grooves.  Speed of turntable, tonearm and cartridge setup (e.g., VTA, VTF, etc.) and the stylus itself all contribute to how accurately the grooves are read.  In the digital world, putting streamers aside for a moment, the comparable factors for a cd player involve the transport mechanism and the laser.  In both examples, this all happens before conversion to an electrical/analog signal.  Therefore accuracy is really the sole goal here.  And accuracy is obviously far easier to achieve in the digital realm (which I think supports @devinplombier ’s point).

2) Conversion to electrical/anslog - here’s where it gets interesting and more challenging, and where lots of differences emerge, both in the digital and analog realms.  For analog, the movement of the cantilever is converted to an electrical signal connected to the moving magnet or moving coil.  And then you’ve got the gain required and RIAA conversion.  Holy smokes, it’s a gd miracle!  On the digital side the “electrical signal” is created by the DAC, which is why we always talk about the DAC as operating in the analog realm.  

Ok, so what makes a streamer special or different from the CD transport?  Absolutely nothing, and that’s the point.  It’s just a different transport whose only purpose should be to read the source material accurately before it is converted to an analog signal.  Just as with turntables and cd transports, streamers can do a better or worse job of adding noise (distortion), but the objective is just accuracy.  There are no “musical” streamers.

@kckrs 

Interesting re Volumio and wifi.  While I have no direct experience of that streamer, I do have experience with 4 others using wifi in my house.  They are: iFi Zen streamer, Pro-ject S2 Ultra, Okto DAC8 with raspberry pi self-installed, and self-assembled freestanding raspberry pi .  I have had zero problems with all of those.  I would postulate that quality of your wifi is a much better indication of whether it would work well or not, and there are pretty easy diagnostics you can run to assess that.  Good luck.  

the objective is just accuracy.  There are no “musical” streamers.

@mdalton 

Allow me to play devil’s advocate 🙂

Lots of people claim to hear sound quality differences between streamers:

Some are straight-up legit - either they upgraded a budget, value-engineered streamer to a decently built one, or they exchanged a noisy switching power supply for a nice linear regulated one.

Then you have the received-dogma / "fashion victim" / confirmation-bias crowd, but we are not going to talk about them because this is a nice thread and a nice forum.

Finally, there are bona fide audiophiles who have good ears, good credentials, a solid knowledge of digital audio and an open mind, who are able to quite articulately describe sonic differences between expensive, high-end streamers.

I trust these folks. What gives?