SP10 Mk II vs Mk III

Dear Lewm/Hiho: I agree with you that the DD stock DD plinths degrade its quality performance and I'm still " against " any plinth with the SP-10s.

I'm still using one of my SP-10s ( with out electronic mods. )with out plinth and tonearm mounted in a stand alone tonearm-tower ( I don't either " buy " the statement that the tonearm/TT has to be in the same " house ", the ears tell me I don't have to worry about: huge improvement. ).

As I posted I hear/heard several Sp-10s configurations in several different audio systems, including at least two-three SP-10s of the people that posted in this thread.

IMHO no one of those SP-10s can even the quality performance of a " naked " Sp-10.
I like all those plinths ( especially the SD ones. ) that are just beautiful but if you don't care about how that/your TT looks and cares how to achieve the top quality performance you can/could achieve with the Sp-10s ( and other great DD out there. ) my advise is to try the full " naked " alternative ( you can always return to your today TT configuration. ).

IMHO I think that is worth to try it, at the " end of the day " why everyone already work on all those SP-10 mods ( electronics, mats, plinths, cables, etc, etc. )?, I understand that is to improve its quality performance: well what I'm saying is that after all those SP-10 mods there is more " land " to explore in favor of better quality performance ( TT neutrality. ).

Anyway I think that this thread and its posts are saying to today TT designers/builders that they have to have better products in the near future because all those vintage TT's are in many ways even better than today TT designs.

Regards and enjoy the music,
Raul.

Dear Raul, You were once kind enough to post photos of your SP10 with "no plinth". As I recall it does sit in a piece of plywood, but it is supported underneath the chassis by some Audio Technica or similar compliant "feet". I always thought that this was the key to your satisfaction with that setup, rather than absence of a plinth per se. As for mounting the arm on a pod that is totally outboard from the chassis and not physically associated with it, I do think that is a bad idea. But to each his own; certainly a few tt-makers now do it that way too, altho I know of no vintage tts designed that way. In your earlier photos I got the impression that your tonearm is mounted on the plywood that also is forming a surround for your SP10, thereby creating a coupling of sorts between the two. I thought that was OK. Anyway, we can argue theory all day long. As you suggest, the proof of the pudding is in the listening. I still like slate; I think it's uniquely suited to this endeavor. I think slate is way better than some of the materials that have traditionally been used, e.g., wood, marble, granite.

Raul, do you use any footers for the "naked" SP10 or you just let its bottom cover or belly acting as support?

Any picture you can show us?

As I posted I hear/heard several Sp-10s configurations in several different audio systems, including at least two-three SP-10s of the people that posted in this thread.

IMHO no one of those SP-10s can even the quality performance of a " naked " Sp-10.

Raul, this is why I get upset with you, making a comment like that with absolutely no foundation. It's obvious the comparison was aimed at my system and Steve Dobbins system since you were a guest at both of our homes.

How anyone can audition a system with everything different than yours, speakers, amps, cables, cartridge, room treatments and all the other variable. Add in the fact you traveled from another country, had a few hours to listen and without your own version or "mod" of the table is beyond me.

I've ask your advice on moving magnet cartridges since you have so much experience with them but when you post something so off the wall as you have, I begin to question your test methods and the validity of your opinion.

Based on what you've posted it appears Hiho is wrong, Kaneta is wrong, Steve Dobbins is wrong, Mike Lavigne is wrong and I'm wrong. Reminds me of Jimmy Durante dancing with the Radio City Rockettes when he looks into the crowd and says

"What do you know, they're all out of step but me."

Dear Lewm: There is no more plywood ( that was used to mount the tonearm but not anymore. ) and the AT footers are still there supporting the TT.

Now, what I'm saying is only that any one of you could try the " naked " alternative ( I know a " ugly " look but.... ) you don't lose almost nothing because you can go back of what you have today.

Anyway, I don't want to start any controversy about: it is only try it or not, you always are the best judge on your system performance.

Regards and enjoy the music,
raul.