Strange turntable/speaker issue


OK, this is going to be lengthy, but here goes....

I have a feeling someone else has experienced this, and want to get some advice in how to correct this issue.

Some background; I could not keep myself from wondering just how good the old vinyl I had boxed up for years would sound compared to my digital set-up, which sounds pretty good to me right now. But, out of curiosity, I finally dragged up my old turntable that has been stored in my basement for 15 years (since I moved in), and probably have not used it in at least 25-30 years total. Originally purchased in the mid 70’s, it is a basic Kenwood KD-2055 with the heavy composite ‘granite’ base. After getting it set-up, I realized very quickly the old Ortofon OM 5E cartridge I installed in the mid-80’s was not going to ‘cut it’, and could not compete with my CD’s, files, or streaming set-up. So, after doing a bit of research, and not knowing yet if going back to some vinyl listening would stick, I purchased a Grado Premier Red, mounted it in the shell, set it up, and yes, it is a vast improvement. Much better overall dynamic range, soundstage, imaging, etc. than the Ortofon 5E. I thought to myself, ‘this may just work’. But, as I was checking some things out, I realized my Vandersteen 2CE’s were actually moving quite a bit (volume was a bit high, but not overly so). That is no easy task. I got back behind the Vandy’s and the rear 10” acoustic coupler was actually moving in and out at a fairly rapid speed, thus causing the speakers to actually move on the anchor stands quite noticeably. Now, this was not really effecting the sound, or creating sound in and of itself, but it can’t be good. First thing I thought was I had misconnected the cartridge leads at the shell, so double checked, and they are connected as per the Grado instructions. BTW, this could have been happening with the old Ortofon as well, but I may not have noticed. Overall, while playing music, the turntable also seems highly sensitive to moving/walking around as the music was playing without distortion. I don’t have to tell you, this does not happen with CD’s or digital files.

I have my turntable on top of a pretty beefy steel frame with wood shelves 60” long ‘TV stand’, as yes, my system also acts as a ‘home theater’ setup, as well as a 2 channel set-up for music. The Vandy 2CE’s are my ‘front’ and 2 channel speakers driven separately by a B&K 125.2 power amp. The lowest shelf of this unit consists of CD storage, the middle shelf my B&K amp, Yamaha V871 receiver (I use as my pre in 2 channel, although it does little as the front channel pre-out’s go directly to the B&K, and while playing music I run in ‘pure direct’), CD player, and PS Audio DAC which all my CD’s, files, and streaming runs through. The top shelf is my TV, Elac center speaker, and my turntable. At this time I am using the Yamaha phono stage (that could change soon, as I think a dedicated phono pre-amp would help things a lot). The TV/equipment stand sits directly to the side of the right speaker, not between the Vandy’s, as they are on each side of my fireplace. The turntable is about 4 1/2’ from the right speaker, and right about the same level of the Vandy’s front 8” woofer.

So, all that said, I have a feeling what I am getting is sonic feedback between the speaker and turntable, perhaps with the cartridge acting as a microphone getting hit with the sound waves from the right speaker, even with the dust cover down. Because of room and layout constraints, I have very limited locations for all this stuff, so not sure a relocation of the turntable is really possible, and if I did, would have to get long male/female RCA interconnect extensions to get back to my Yamaha, or any future phono pre-amp, which would still have to run back to the Yamaha probably utilizing the analog Audio 2 inputs, as the Audio 1 inputs are serving the PS Audio DAC.

So, is sonic feedback what I am witnessing? Or could it be something else? And is there any easy solution? I doubt isolation feet will solve anything if feedback between the right speaker and turntable is the problem.


128x128bkeske
Extremely interesting thread.
Everyone and their dog was concentrating on vibration and isolation, rightly so with the facts presented, and yet it transpires it is the interface between platter and vinyl is the issue.

Who would have taken a guess at that?
No one obviously... Lol.

It sounds like the vinyl must have been free to move on the platter just a little too freely, likely causing excessive stylus movement in the grooves.
A fix for $26. Not too bad at all although I am sure any of the isolation techniques employed will not have hurt one bit.

One benefit of my room is a solid concrete floor that is then tiled AND I have been using a Mitchell record clamp in like forever!

Now enjoy the music!
Yep.

I have to wonder if the clamp would have helped on the old Kenwood, but that ‘water is under the bridge’ so to speak (as it had other issues). The Kenwood had a sturdy rubber mat, and the Pro-Ject came with a flimsy felt mat, which I replaced with an acrylic mat (which I wanted to try before considering the acrylic platter upgrade option). That didn’t help with the problem, but does sound better. However, I did try the Pro-Ject with the Kenwood rubber mat before the acrylic mat arrived with no improvement.

As an ‘old fart’ who never used weights or clamps back in the 70’s, I just wasn’t convinced I needed one. Well, as it turns out, it was a $26 gold mine.

And yes, have been playing vinyl all afternoon without issue.


Congratulations , just read through this thread for the first time . Most of my original problems,  which sounded somewhat similar to a few of yours, was fixed with an Audioquest Sorbel record Mat . Now if I can get my records off the Mat a little easier that would be great ! 
All very interesting and one for the books. Have you tried removing the turntable lid, at least when playing?
I don’t use the lid while playing. Actually cannot with this particular clamp.

I have been playing a lot of vinyl lately. Up till using that clamp, I truly wasn’t sure I would ever warm-up to vinyl over CD’s/streaming (and I grew up on LP’s, but basically completely switched towards the late 80’s) as I could never get my system to where I really enjoyed it, but now I have re-realized just how great it can sound. It made that big of a difference. In fact, my system now is better than I have ever had before in terms of vinyl, still not ‘high end’ any means, but extremely enjoyable and engaging. Good enough to now possibly upgrade more over time though.

As I seek out a lot of stuff on vinyl not available on CD’s or streaming, it definitely has its place to keep building on my collection, and not feel it’s ‘second rate’, just different, and it some cases, yes, more enjoyable. And that’s the key to stick with a media.