Sub recommendation for vienna acoustics bach grand

As a VA Bach Grand owner, count me in as another who suggests you should consider a new amp first and get a way from the limited power supplies that AVR's offer. And don't be misled by the big watts per channel that the AVR manufacturers claim - they can seldom approach these numbers CONTINUOUSLY with all channels driven. Especially with low impedence speakers like VA's.

The Bach Grands, as with all VA speakers, are 4 ohm and crave power. Feed them a minimum of 125 watts of true high curent power and you'll see what those 7" woofers can do on their own. They are quite amazing if you like clean, tight, fast bass that provides a good hit. They won't shake the chair or sofa you're on, but that not real bass in music anyway. Thats LFE better left for a sub in a movie. I run my VA Bachs and Theatro Grands with a 125 wpc Parasound multi-channel amp and it gets them as loud as I could possibly want without a breaking a sweat.

But to answer your question about a sub, I run my Bachs with a REL T-1, a very musical sub. I also use the two simultaneous connections that REL suggests. The traditional LFE cable for the .1 channel in movies and the high level neutrik speakon connection from the L/R speakers terminal on the amp itself. After careful room placement and settling upon a cutoff of around 52 hz, the REL T-1 compliments the Bachs nicely for music. It fills in the last two octaves and keeps up with the speed of the Bachs woofers. If you take the forums advice and consider rethinking your amp, I then suggest you check out REL's. Quite a few VA owners use them.

Bonginator, here’s a recent thread you should read about a guy that experienced exactly what we are saying. He upgraded a 125w amp that, if anything, would only be slightly better than receiver power, to a high quality 150w amp.

His comments after installing the amp start at 3-20-13.

http://forum.audiogon.com/cgi-bin/fr.pl?aamps&1361045276&openfrom&84&4#84

I know all of this sidetracks your original question, so what are you thinking?

Agree with Zd542 and Schubert, those speakers need a quality, high current amp of at least 200w/ch to get the performance they are capable of. Sound from them will improve in every way, not just the bass.

I would tend to agree with ZD542. The Bach Grands are 4 ohm nominal speakers, meaning they probably dip below 4 ohms in part of the audio band. Very few receivers are capable of properly driving a 4 ohm or less load.

Buying a separate amp that is rated to drive 4 ohm loads will result in better bass definition and control. As ZD542 mentioned, you may find the need for a subwoofer is mitigated or even eliminated. I would certainly try this first before investing in a subwoofer.

You may want to consider auditioning something like Emotiva's XPA-200: 240 watts/ch. (into 4 ohms) stereo amp which has a 5-year warranty. The cost is only $499 (with free shipping) and they give you 30-days in-home trial and will pay to ship the unit back if you decide not to keep it.

http://shop.emotiva.com/collections/amplifiers/products/xpa200

The Emotiva amps are seriously good for the money...

-RW-

Zd542 told it like it is, until you get a strong 200 watt + amp you will never even know what your speakers sound like and if you even need a sub.
In a room that large, with those speakers, I would not settle for an amp with less than 300w a side at 4 ohms.
Plus, using a sub in a room with even dimensions would be quite a trick.

Magic 8 ball says: Ask again.

Home Theater setup used REL B2 with Vienna Acoustics Haydns Grands.

Other options:
JL Audio
REL R Series
Paradigm Sub 12

Another option you may want to consider is to upgrade your amp first. You're only going to get so much out of your receiver. If you give the speakers more power,they should give you much better bass than what you already have. After that, then get subs if you feel that you still need them. The reason I say upgrade you amp first is that you may choose a different sub because of the amps effect in your system.