SUT - electrical theory and practical experience

@rauliruegas 

In that post that you refer to, you mention:

"A SUT is not a passive device because any audio signal passing trhough those transformers makes that the " hundreds " of meters on each transformer react to that signal and starts the degradation and you have to think that the signal has a " long trip " inside each transformer wires and at each mm. the audio signal is degrading by that SUT. 

In the other side a good SS active high gain design say ith bipolar  active devices the signal must pass only trhough a matched pair of transistors in that first critical gain stage and degradation is at minimum way lower that in a SUT."

However, a signal in a SUT doesn't pass through meters of wire, nor does it necessarily have more degradation than transistors. . .unless you can point me to scientific papers. . . 

Dear @drbond : The signal in a SUT pass through the primary windings and the by induction runs in the secondary windings. This proccess means degradation levels. Now, if signal does not pass through " meters of wire " as you said then why with the same SUT overall characteristics an EMIA cooper SUT " sounds " different " than a silver wired or why a silver crossover inductor sounds different than the same unit/same manufacturer cooper inductor.

Along all what happens inside a SUT: what does the cartridge signal passthrough in your CH with an additional SUT?

signal must goes through the SUT female input connectors and solder joints along the IC cable and the cable male connectors and solder joints. Same proccess to the other side/output of the SUT.

In an active high gain unit instead all those kind of tourtose paths signal need a pair of bipolar devices. I could think that your CH is a good design with no RFI problems down there and with wide bandwindth and high overload margin.

I think that you are trying to justify your self a SUT in your system that makes no sense to me but always is an alternative. Just try it, no problem for any one and in this way you could learn something about or confirm what you already know.

You do not need " scientific papers " because no one that I know already makes in real time simulations with both kind of designs to look any kind of measurements you can have in mind.

Banwindth limitation in a SUT is a disadvanatge vs active designs and this you can attest when you paired your CH with a SUT through test listening sessions with the same LP tracks, is so obviously that only a " deaf " man can’t distinguish in between but you have to experience it.

Remember that my target is to stay truer to the recording, I don’t know wich your targets and I don’t care really because is you who are asking and needs to live that experience.

I posted here that my special modified Denon /Murata SUT in my phonolinepreamp, where the dedicated dual mono MM is nothing but a first rate design, performs really good but a " little " short to the active high gain  dedicated dual mono MC bipolar stage.

R.

The Coil on the Cartridge > Cartridge Connections > Internal Wand Wire > Pillar Connections > RCA Phono Cable and Connectors are all able to have an impact on how the Signal is sent and the SQ of the Signal is to be perceived.

A Dedicated MC Stage is one that in many cases, might not be able to compensate for upstream influences on the signal and create a presentation that has an attraction that is on parity with the attraction that can be created, using separate ancillaries that can have an influence that compensates for upstream influences on the signal path.

There is no doubt that the option to influence the SQ and presentation with the use of an ancillary that bypasses a use of a Dedicated MC Stage and creates a MC Stage through adapting a MM Input to take on the role of a MC Stage, is one that has won over many adopters of this as their chosen method.

The Math behind the differing options is only one part of the equation.

The interface chosen and the impact it has on the end listener is substantially more important, as this is where the satisfaction in enjoyment of the Vinyl chain is to be found. It is hard to convince most that the Math should be their end goal behind their choices made. 

Trusting in Designers and their Skills to produce a Device that is a correct interface as an inclusion in a Circuit and Signal Path, is the most typical and successful route to finding the methodology that offers the most attraction.

@dover is testament to this, his route to have an ancillary that satisfies has ben realised through his trust in his EE and their design for a Bespoke device.

I'm glad it is revealed as I am keen to learn more and will approach the subject with my most trusted EE Designer, to see what I can learn about the concept.   

Hi @intactaudio ,

Finally, the overload points (1% THD+N) for the 834P were 69.2mV at 1kHz, 260mV at 20kHz, and 7.85mV at 20Hz.

Hi @pindac ,

I had the original EAR 834. I like it but I saw it was built with very cheap components and power supply. Romy The Cat article "End Of Live Phonostage" inspired me to build my DIY EAR 834 with better parts (including air capacitors, z-foil and AN silver Tantalum resistors, Jupiter signal capacitors,...) and power supply with LCLC filtering, parallel voltage regulator based on 0A2 tubes and different other upgrades.

So, my DIY EAR 834 is a different animal compared to the original one. The schematics is very important but the implementation is even more.

Regards,

Alex.