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Talk but not walk?

Hi Guys

This isn't meant to start a fight, but it is important to on lookers. As a qualifier, I have my own audio forum where we report on audio issues as we empirically test them. It helps us short cut on theories and developing methods of listening. We have a wide range of systems and they are all over the world adding their experiences to the mix. Some are engineers, some are artist and others are audiophiles both new and old. One question I am almost always asked while I am visiting other forums, from some of my members and also members of the forum I am visiting is, why do so many HEA hobbyist talk theory without any, or very limited, empirical testing or experience?

I have been around empirical testing labs since I was a kid, and one thing that is certain is, you can always tell if someone is talking without walking. Right now on this forum there are easily 20 threads going on where folks are talking theory and there is absolutely no doubt to any of us who have actually done the testing needed, that the guy talking has never done the actual empirical testing themselves. I've seen this happen with HEA reviewers and designers and a ton of hobbyist. My question is this, why?

You would think that this hobby would be about listening and experience, so why are there so many myths created and why, in this hobby in particular, do people claim they know something without ever experimenting or being part of a team of empirical science folks. It's not that hard to setup a real empirical testing ground, so why don't we see this happen?

I'm not asking for peoples credentials, and I'm not asking to be trolled, I'm simply asking why talk and not walk? In many ways HEA is on pause while the rest of audio innovation is moving forward. I'm also not asking you guys to defend HEA, we've all heard it been there done it. What I'm asking is a very simple question in a hobby that is suppose to be based on "doing", why fake it?

thanks, be polite

Michael Green

www.michaelgreenaudio.net


128x128michaelgreenaudio
geoffkait's avatar
geoffkait
23,365 posts
 
I’m undecided about you, Costco. I can’t decide whether you’re mildly retarded or uneducated or just having a series of DMT flashbacks. 😀
Post removed 
audionuttoo
5 posts
 
I'm not posting as a response to anyone, just adding my own 2 cents.  First of all, remember that we have all been born with the world's best and most sensitive listening devices ever conceived - our own ears!  Trust them - they are the one truth in music!  I have experienced the tunable room in person, at Bill333's place, and know that it works.  I was left alone with the tuning wrench and allowed to experiment and make adjustments to my liking. It became obvious very quickly that the adjustments were very intuitive and easy to learn.  I was able to turn a small and constricted sound stage into a large open and expansive one that extended in all directions around me!  Then I was able to bring it back to points in between and eventually back to where I started simply by adjusting the tension on the panels.  Less tension allowed the panels to vibrate more, extending the sound stage. More tension = less vibration = smaller sound stage.  Pretty intuitive right?  How do I know this works?  My ears told me so!  Tuning works my droogies!  And while not all tuning is as intuitive as this, the idea of loosening things to allow them to vibrate more and increase the size of the sound stage always does work!  How do I know this?  My ears tell me so!  Those who have not heard it have no basis to criticize it. Those who have not should try it.  Those who have will know it works if they listen to the music with their own sensitive listening devices - their ears!
nonoise's avatar
nonoise
10,878 posts
 
Research shows that those who've used serotonergic compounds typically have fewer flashbacks of prior life experiences than those who never have.
WTF?

All credibility goes out the window when we go into the weeds.
Stay on topic folks. This was entertaining in a big brain standoff sort of way. 

All the best,
Nonoise
bill333
4 posts
 
@prof 

"bill333 can you give us a non-mystical, technical explanation for how removing the chassis top of a component would cause those audible differences (or releasing of the capacitor)?"

I have no technical explanations for this, and no interest in finding any. There may be people out there who enjoy observing scientifically unexplained phenomena and constructing theories to fit them, but that's not the hobby I'm engaged in. I'm trying to create great music listening experiences. Simply put, I don't see how having a well explained system is going to give me better sound. OTOH, if you have practical ideas on how to get better sound from my system, I'd be glad to hear them...

"(BTW, I’ve had the top off some of my equipment before - pre-amps etc - for different reasons and...no...it did not change the sound)."

There could be any number of factors involved in your not hearing a change in sound. Without being there to hear for myself, and subsequent experimenting with your system and room, I really can't say what happened. The most likely explanation is that some component or components in your system are closed down to the point that upstream changes can't easily be heard.

But let's get to the point of your post. You're not here to help people get better sound. Having read through your posts on this thread, I can't find a single instance of you doing or saying anything that would help another person improve their system. You're here to cast aspersions on anyone whose methods who don't fit into your mental model of how things work. Let me be clear in saying that my experiences are my own, and are posted here in the hope that others can benefit from them. These are things that have worked for me. If you, or anyone reading this, tries these methods and benefits from them, I am genuinely happy about that. If you choose not to try, that's ok too. But I have no interest in trying to fit my experiences into your dogmatic belief system.

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