Tekton Double Impacts

ICC, well it is always active and I have not listened with it off. I must say I don't know that much about it and should read more in my manual. My bad. I will do so now. 

Here is the explanation from the Lyngdorf site. I understand the point and just know it, the unit,  sounds very good:)  Someone smarter than I in these matters, such as Almag, can perhaps comment on the theory anyway. 

"ICC (INTER-SAMPLE CLIPPING CORRECTION)

When music is being mastered, the level is often very high; upon analysis, you will often find several consecutive maximum samples, indicating something has been clipped away from the original signal. Audio that exceeds 0 dBFS (decibels relative to full scale) will sound very compressed because the headroom is nonexistent. This harsh sound is an unfortunate trend in the music industry and is typically referred to as “the loudness war.”

In order to compensate for this, we have created ICC (Inter-sample Clipping Correction). With ICC, the TDAI-2170 can automatically adjust up to 12dB headroom in the signal processing to avoid clipping of the signal. Through this you will enjoy the full dynamic range and a more natural sound."

http://www.lyngdorf.com/media/43162/without-icc.jpg?width=1800&height=1350&mode=crop&qua...

http://www.lyngdorf.com/media/43163/with-icc.jpg?width=1800&height=1350&mode=crop&qualit...

Hi Bill (Grannyring),

I’ve had occasion to examine the waveforms and associated statistics of tracks from about a dozen or so CDs, encompassing pop, rock, and classical music, using a professional audio editing program (Sound Forge). Most did not have a single sample that reached full scale (i.e., the maximum possible digital value). A couple of them did, both being classical works having very wide dynamic range, but even in those cases that only occurred for a handful of brief instants during the course of a lengthy work. While on the rest of the CDs the maximum instantaneous volume of any sample ranged between a fraction of a db below full scale and many db below full scale. And I would expect in cases where the maximum sample value comes close to full scale that the original captures were made with much greater margins, and levels were subsequently boosted during the mastering process with software assuring that the maximum sample value would not reach 0 db.

In general, I would expect that with the possible exception of some works having extremely wide dynamic range any reasonably competent recording engineer would make a point of not over-driving (exceeding the maximum possible digital value of) the A/D converter.

So I would not expect the issue referred to in the ICC writeup to be much if any concern on the vast majority of recordings.

Also, the major contributor to what is referred to as the "loudness wars" is not what is described in the writeup. That term is usually used to refer to dynamic compression that is intentionally applied in the engineering of the recording, to make soft passages louder and loud passages softer. That creates the perception of a louder recording than if dynamics were not compressed, and makes the recording better suited to noisy environments, such as cars, and more attention grabbing in such environments.

So the bottom line seems to me to be that **IF** the ICC is implemented such that it does nothing unless samples reach 0 db (full scale) it will make no difference on most recordings, and only an occasional difference on the others.

Best regards,
-- Al

The Lingdorf product that most interests me (but out of my league) is the MP-50. The thing I am trying to understand is that I understood that the shortest path between analog and digital is one of their hallmarks. The MP-50 is strictly a processor (as are most on the market that are not an AV receiver). So since this requires an outboard multi-channel amplifier, doesn’t that make the analog-digital path the same as any other product on the market? I am not getting something basic here I think. The Lingdorf products are excellent but not value like I perceive the DI or Vidar to be. Those are champagne at beer prices whereas the Lingdorf is champagne at champagne prices. Not to say it is not worth it, but not the kind of value I try and look for.

Thanks a bunch Al. Your post makes complete sense.

Vitop, the Lyngdorf is a killer value when one looks at it in its whole. It is not an amp. It is a complete rig with other add-ons and options. I replaced over $22,000 worth of separates and wire with a $4000-$4500 unit. That’s seems to me to be a killer value. Others are doing the same.

I sold the following when I picked up the 2170.

- Tube Research Labs preamp - Super Dude
- Luxman DA06 dac
- Von Gaylord tube monoblock smps
- all manner of room correction panels and traps
- 4 power cords
- digital cable
- 2 set of ICs
- various footers

That’s what going to a one box solution does.

I also gained many other capabilities that I did not have before. Room correction is the biggest one. So yeah, please consider the cost of a preamp, dac, amplifiers, cables, cords, footers, and physical room treatments.

I understand thinking of it as just am amp or int amp, but that is not what it is. My previous preamp alone cost more, much more, than the Lyngdorf. Many folks own a dac or amp or preamp alone that costs more than the 2170 system.

One could purchase the DI speakers for $3000 and the Lyngdorf for $4500.  Great system for $7500 new.  All that is needed is a streamer or computer as a source. Killer value all around when one spends under $10,000 for what is arguably a system that competes with many systems costing 4-10x that. The electronics/wire  driving the high value DI speakers in this scenario are of equal high value.......most spend a much higher percentage on the electronics and wire for their systems.  

I suggest buying the Duelund 16ga stranded copper wire in cotton or NOS Western Electric 10ga copper wire in cotton (speaker cable) for $2-$10 foot depending on the one you choose. No connectors needed and just use the bare wire which is tinned and will not oxidize.  

Great at times for an audiophile!