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Thorens TD520 vs a restored Thorens TD125

I have been going around looking to buy my first TT, listening to many tables in the last one month. My current inference is that, mid level "modern" TTs (within $5k) dont cut enough for me. May be because they are designed to be revealing, they also end up revealing their own flaws :-). Either they sound thin or slow or sometimes very CD like. The good modern TTs are all in the 10k range (I am talking about the price of the table only).
Interestingly I still like the classic old school TT sound from the likes of Thorens TD125/160, Garrard 301 etc. There is something about their sound which is sweet and "analogue". They do lack detail and micro dynamics of the new age table but still have some rightness to the music. I dont know how to describe this character and what makes them do it.

This is the reason I have taken a step back and again started considering the older TTs. Currently there are two TTs on Audiogon which I am considering,

1. Thorens TD520 (stock with Thorens 12" tonearm)
2. Thorens TD125 MK2 totally restored by Christopher Thornton of Artisan Fidelity with Origin Live tonearm.

I have not heard any of these TTs and being in Singapore doesnt help. I have heard Thorens TTs and like them.

Can someone please post some opinion on which of these would be a better performer sonically ? I know both TD125 and TD520 were reference models of their time but the 520 definitely looks like a bigger performer. I am confused.

BTW, I have another thread running in the Analog section where we are discussing modern TTs to consider. I wanted to keep the classic TT discussion seperate.
pani
td160
74 posts
 
Would you care to back up those claims of falling quality at Thorens with examples?

My impression is that Thorens had some winners and losers during the 80's and nineties. However they continued to develop and improve their product up until the mid 1990's when they attempted to diversify with other electronics products like CD players, which did not sell enough to save the failing company.

But I would not say that they let product quality drop below the levels they had during their prosperous 1970's.

As regards bearing quality. Imo the best bearings they made went into the TD124. Nice heavy steel. Rebuildable. The TD125 does not have a better bearing than any of the other models. Good quality hardened steel shaft. But the housing is not designed to allow replacement of the bushings or thrust.

That remained consistent from the mid 1960's onward on all of their models afterward.
jeremy72
97 posts
 
Both TD125 MkI and MkII had a better bearings than many models, which should be obvious anyway due to their status and placement within the line during the time of production. Examples of Thorens models with lesser quality bearings than the TD125 models:

TD126 (all)
TD160MKII (Except Super)
TD166
TD104
TD115
TD105
TD170
TD190
TD295

(Many more, not worth listing)

The TD125 was built to higher standards than the models listed above (bearings included) because it WAS a higher model in the lineup.

Yes, the TD124 did have nice bearings, I agree with you there.

Thorens had starting building some real clunkers towards the late seventies and into the eighties. I'd say the digital revolution had something to do with that.
jeremy72
97 posts
 
The original bushings used in the TD124's bearings were nylon and not that hot. Those can be replaced with better sintered bronze ones though. The actual housing itself and end caps weren't too bad on the TD124's considering their age but there is still much room for improvement.

The TD125's came factory equipped with quality sintered bronze bushings though from the get go and a larger bore spindle. Thrust plates and end caps were ok, not the best but pretty decent.

Don't mean to hijack this thread into a TD124 debate, just wanted to mention a couple things here.

td160
74 posts
 
You do not offer proof for any of your claims. Just here-say.

Can you tell us in what way a TD125 bearing is better than, say, a TD320 bearing? Can you describe the differences?
jeremy72
97 posts
 
Your words then are just as here-say as mine. Do your own homework, if your research if accurate, will result in the same findings as mine regarding the models mentioned in the above post.

By the way, the TD320 was not on my list.

Draw your own conclusions then based on your own research, this is always the best and most accurate way of evaluating the remarks of others.

This is why forums sometimes become silly contests of "who knows it all" in which the answer is always the same. Nobody. Peace.. I've got some music to listen to...


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