Why are subwoofers so polarizing?

What I do is I send clients to shops were they sell Velodyne. It is not my responsibility how they do there demo. This is a very easy way to convince. I never heard a demo of a Velodyne at a show that I was thrilled. I Always have my own cd's with me. I give you one clear example; Jacintha Her name is, number 6, I am in the mood for love( I use it Always to test speed, and imaging)Contrabass is on the left side of this recording. And it needs to be very direct and small in proportion. At a show with Velodyne and at home of a client with A DD18 I had the same experience with the same number. Instruments become bigger and the image is getting less focussed. I am still waiting for a demo with Velodyne to get a big smile on my face. The only part I liked is they solve the acoustic problems in the low freq. even in a small room. But I never heard a stereo demo of Velodyne ( every year you find some Velodyne demo's at shows) that the sub was full integrated with the speakers and the image had an extreme direct to point out and touchable image. Or you think the people who gave these demo's are all that stuppid!!

I do not think there is a simple answer to the original question. IMO there are
many reasons. First, my feeling is that initially many speaker manufactures
had very little understanding (if any) about the interaction between a sub,
room and main speakers, so they simple did not know how to built a proper
subwoofer. Combining this with the purist approach mentioned above by
Martykl, it is easy to understand how the myth about subwoofers being
detrimental to the sound has started. Second, my feeling is that a significant
percent of the audiophiles have never heard a properly set up subwoofer. This
is because most dealers are unable to properly set up a sub, viz. they have no
idea about interference phenomena (i.e. the way waves interact) and do not
understand how a sub interacts with the room and main speakers. In the
other camp, we have the audiophiles who have aheard a properly integrated
subwoofer, and, of course, bass freaks who want a lot of bass no matter
what.

The fact is, however, that eventually people (i.e. scientists) have taken the
time to study and understand subwoofers properly. Proof of this is not only
the fact that new subs are much better than the old ones (e.g. REL Stentor 3 &
Studio 3 are simply no match for the new Velodine and SVS subs), but also the
wealth of softwares available these days which do wonders when it comes to
integrating a sub into a system. I believe Bo 100% when he says that he gets
marvelous results with the help of such softwares. I get marvelous results too.

Finally, regarding Bo, I should say that, I have cross paths with him here on
audiogon quite a few times, and my experience is that trying to have an
intelligent dialog with him is like trying to communicate with an untrained
chimp or a parrot. He will keep on repeating the same things over and over
again irrespectively of what the other are saying/asking. Take 5 minutes and
glance at his answers, he has hijacked so many threads by writing over and
over again the same things he has also written in this thread.

Bo, it is commendable that a dealer recommends not very expensive (given
hi-end standards) electronics and speakers (e.g. Monitor Audio Platinum
speakers and subwoofers, Pass Labs amps and the Onkyo receivers with
audissey pro software) over much more expensive ones, but the way you do it
is unprofessional and tiring.

Wenn it would be unprofessional I would never been the absolute sound of a show. At the end it is the quality of a demo what makes it better compared to the others. It is all about timing and speed. If the timing is better the realism in sound gets better. For subwoofers the level in integration is depending of the speed. If the speed is lower it is more difficult to integrate. The main thing I do not like about the Velodyne is that the stage is less sharp. Maybe Audyssey Pro can create a better integration with the Velodyne sub. I don't know because I did not listen to a Velodyne with this measurment. But with there own measurment I did not hear the accuracy I would want wenn I play in stereo. Nothing more, nothing less. Only for one year I have got a level in integration that satisfied me about subwoofers. Without this measurment I would still not used a subwoofer for stereo use. I understand that the integration of a subwoofer is not easy. But it is possible now.

Why are continuing to berate a product that you have no personal contact with?
You take your golden ear measurements at shows and other unfamiliar environments and come to some arbitrary conclusions.

You have admitted to having no experience with Velodyne Manual Room Optimization witch can be used in many different ways not simply for attaining a flat response. Getting a flat response can simply be a starting point towards multiple settings that reflect ones personal tastes and stored in its presets to be called up by the remote on the fly.

Don't you think you would be better served in describing your method of integrating the products you actually sell. I've heard some pedestrian EQ lacking subwoofers dialed in amazingly well with Audyssey products. Maybe you could take a more positive track here and discuss your experience with Audyssey.

I never heard ANY sub blend well with the main speakers...Until I heard a REL B2. Which I now own.I use the Signal Cable Spkon connector right from the main amps taps. My main speakers seem to be much more engaging than before.And of course I can hear much more low level information that was not there before.I am totally thrilled with the results from the REL.