small companies making today's best products

Dear Elizabeth, I got from your answer, you don't like dealers. !

The fact that most of the guys on Audiogon, are ever changing equipment striving to get a good sounding system makes me disgusted with the bargain mentality that values price over knowledge and experience.

I have been in this business for over 25 years and I have sold thousands of components and assembled 100's of systems, to think that a hobbyist knows more than a good dealer is laughable.

The idea is to get off the equipment roller coaster and enjoy music! To that effect the hostility engendered against dealers on this site is a sad state of affairs, there are many good, caring, and helpful dealers that provide a real service a demonstration facility and the knowledge and experience to actually make someone's assembled bunch of stuff really work cohesively!

The problem with Audiogon is that it encourages this flea market mindset, instead of encouraging many users to seek the assistance of professional people that can really help them in their quest to make a real satisfying musical experience in their home.

Are there bad dealers yes, I used to work for SBS in the City where what the customer actually wanted came after profitability or moving what was in stock, with that said, there were a few great salespeople there.

When I started in the industry as a profession in 1989 there was a bond between the customer and the dealer, the dealer was their guide, and provided a real service.

What pisses me off mostly about Audiogon is that most of the posters have limited experience and many suggestions they make are wrong or laughable at best, I have read some excellent suggestions from some members that were right on the money, but the often dismissive and sometimes hostile comments directed at dealers is stupid.

How does a dealer know what he knows, why does he or she advocate the products they have, I would bet for most dealers it is the positive experiences that they have had in direct comparison to other products that they sell have forged their opinions and product lines, for most dealers, they have to purchase their equipment which puts them in the same boat as their prospective clients, we are both purchasers. I don't know of too many people who purchase stuff they themselves don't like.

If I was in it "just for the money" I would be selling loudspeakers from a certain company which makes very expensive and very particular loudspeakers which have come on very strongly over the last few years, after evaluating said product, I passed over it as I didn't think that this $25k loudspeaker was worth the money, I watched SBS pick up the line and make a mint with it!

The point I am making is that most dealers are purchasers just like their clients and as so they advocate the products they believe in and what sounds the best to them.

So instead of just thinking oh that is a dealer and he or she is just trying to "sell me stuff" think again, maybe that dealer is offering advice based on direct experience.

As a dealer, I am bared from selling many products across the States, and I encourage local patronage.

So next time you read a dealers post, and are dismissive think maybe this guy has walked the same path in different shoes.

I once talked to a guy who was looking to swap amps at a great expense when all he needed was a few grand in footers and tuning gear to get the results he wanted, no one who posted suggested that, it was equipment, equipment, equipment, not one word on tuning, and folks what makes magic isn't just gear it is the meticulous setup behind that gear, and for the record that guy never called me back or bought anything!

Dear Elizabeth, I got from your answer, you don't like dealers. !

Hmmm, I didn't get that at all. The only time she mentioned dealers was to thank one for chiming in. Where were you getting that she was criticizing dealers?

FWIW, with almost 30 years in this hobby my experience of dealers is a mixed bag. I've met as many good ones who know of what they are talking, as I have ones whose opinions I did not respect nor agree with, and some real a$$hats as well (fortunately few and far between, but they are out there, even among the most prominent dealers). Just like the variety of folks posting here on Audiogon - I agree with you there to some degree - you really need to ferret out those who aren't talking from very little or no experience, and or just blowing smoke. I do imagine that it's very frustrating being a dealer and having to deal with such a unique (being kind) bunch of characters as audiophiles. I suppose there are also rewards as well (one would hope so anyway). Good dealers may indeed be choosing components on the basis of how well they work together to offer their clients what they think performs best to their ears. But as we regularly see, different strokes for different folks - what sounds good to you, may not be my choice. If there were one single set of best components all dealers would be carrying the same stuff. The fact is there is any infinite number of permutations one can arrive at with all that's out there and none are quite the same. No one has a monopoly on the right answers, but it's certainly nice to have a good guide. That could be a dealer, a manufacturer, a friend, or someone offering suggestions here. The opposite could just as well be true for any of those resources.

I missed that one! Anywho... I imagine there is an unknown percentage here that just likes to keep trying different equipment, and not out of dissatisfaction. Tho, some may never be happy, period. In my case, not being ready to buy for some time, gave me an opportunity to investigate (read) many different options. I knew what I wanted when my time came to purchase. Now I'm VERY (!) happy just investigating many music options! A satisfying benefit of being a dealer would be in making VERY HAPPY costumers!

Regarding small vs. large companies and product quality - it depends upon the type of product and the number of products produced.

I can conceive of a person in their garage designing and making a near state of the art loudspeaker. It would be exponentially harder for that same person to do a 100 unit production run of that speaker. Quality control, crating and shipping cost, marketing and customer/dealer service would overwhelm a single person operation.

I don't imagine that a truly small manufacturer could make a SOTA CD player or even a D/A without the extensive use of off the shelf components. It's here that larger companies can afford the R&D costs that would sink a smaller entity. But even then, mid-sized companies such as MSB can consistently produce top quality products.

Most preamps and amps don't necessarily require sophisticated electronics and small companies can be as good as or even better than larger ones. The larger company could be more efficient and offer a better dollar value, but the small company could readily make a better sounding product.

Personally, I tend to lean towards larger companies because I want the company to be around ten years from now. Size is not a guarantee, but it does shift the odds. Above in this thread someone compared Bryston to Lamm. If a key player at Bryston were to disappear, Bryston would still continue to operate. I'm not sure that can be said of Lamm.

I know some people swear but the small company as somehow morally superior to larger businesses. Even if there were some truth in that assertion, at some point you have to draw a line for practicality. I find it inconceivable that anyone participating in this thread uses a "boutique" cellphone custom designed and made by a one/two man operation in their garage.