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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Halcro you say at the time there was no independent advice on the CAST over VSF. Is there now? I have not seen any?

I sure hope you guys are wrong on the no benefit of CAST. (no offense)

Undertow I sure hope it is not a critical application only to notice the benefit of CAST. I remember some guys saying the Duelund VSF was a waste and I have found it to be a huge jump from Mundorf and I would not call my system critical. In fact in my mind Mundorf has more in common with Sonicaps and cheaper caps than it does with Duelund.

I have been a (total) convert to Steen's thinking that the crossover is the most critical component of the system. That is the reason I have got the CAST. I NOW realise just how critical the crossover is. Now have I gone overboard??? Maybe? but I can say I have listened to more digital since I got the Duelund than in the last 20 years. Sometimes I pinch myself and say this is digital!

I would rate the tweeter caps as the BEST new money I have ever spent on gear, biggest improvement.

Now will the CAST be worth the extra??? I do not know but at least we should give Duelund a chance. Stormen said some guys found the VSF to sound a little rough compared to the CAST. I know I can not imagine that either.
undertow
1,033 posts
 
Point being I believe that the 2% more you may or may not hear with Cheaper drivers in a far simpler 1st or second order crossover its just not complex enough to spend 100% more or something for a very slight window of difference.. I am sure the VSF is a world class cap and in most cases is the true ceiling for the point of diminishing returns.. Again to me a critical application for a cap would be in a Full range electronic piece running the entire frequency range, or VERY complex multi driver type line array speaker..

But remember the cast was more or less developed to close the gap in the extreme case and really was more designed to overcome the lower voltage applications of the VSF.. The cast simply can take more power, my application and most other speakers especially being in the 90 db to 100 db efficiency range will never see that kinda power stress. You have to pick and choose your battles somewhere, my cutoff was at a point that the caps outweight cost and the performance of the possibilities in a speaker design themselves.
undertow
1,033 posts
 
Oh and partsconnexion did ship my parts today finally, they will be in tomorrow for installation.. My crossover is simple and uses only a 1.75 uF cap on the first leg of my horn.. Should be a sweet result I think :-)

If I was running a 1000 watt mono block, with a 85 db really Hi grade driver system in a more exotic speaker I could see where the Cast could come into play...
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
I just talked to parts and my order is in as well.

It seems there was some confusion with the CAST mid caps. I have only (and I say only) VSF for the midrange and two CAST tweeter caps coming. All in all this is Ok. Of course they are cheaper and as you guys say am I may be at the point of diminishing returns??? Maybe. At least I will be able to hear the CAST caps in the all critical tweeter section. Getting VSF's for the midrange does not make me afraid anyway!! Part of me was leary on the the CAST as you said unknown and if better how much better??? What scared me the worst was what if not as good?! I could deal with saying they were not worth the $ extra but what if worse! Scary thought!

I expect my order tomorrow or the next day as well.

My crossover works with the signal going through what will be the VSF mid cap and on to the CAST tweeter cap.

So I will be able to form an opinion on the difference and the value of the difference.
undertow
1,033 posts
 
I am sure the Cast are good and so are the VSF, I think they might sound a little different but probably not better or really preferable in certain given applications. But hey good luck, its a great cap I am sure, at this point no need to be concerned about it.
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