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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
undertow
1,033 posts
 
Volleyguy again I hate to say it for like the 10th time… But your missing so many pieces of the equation looking into one Miracle cap and inductor to solve an entire speaker curve.. First you have very old strangley P.A. Pro like low excursion woofers your trying to improve.. The added mid glare is simply due to showing the weakness now in the woofers frequency range.. Probably will need to re-tune the cabinet being it’s a K-Horn DAMP the hell out of the sidewalls in the triangle and add mass to the basket of the woofer itself..

Also make SURE you have I would say a minimum of 12 gauge copper, but 10 gauge pure copper wire feeding the inductor and the woofer back just the same. You need to build a crossover on several points, not just a part swap, and problem is when your crossover was designed they did not have the types of tests and software to generically get those tolerances and values perfect. So that woofer could in fact be better with a different value inductor than the original was. I mean there is several factors to the hill your climbing. Good luck
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
I just got back and was thinking just what you said Ait. (crosstalk)

I have lots of space should the inductor be as far away from the tweeter caps or the tweeter?

It was you who mention this awhile back when you got a big North Creek inductor, right?

It almost sounds like LF being sent to the incorrect drivers?

Face you could be right as well, I was thinking that might happen (DCR is cut in half) except the signal sounded distorted not just off balance?

Undertow I have had good luck (real good luck) on the parts switch when staying to the same type meaning switching out a Aluminum foil in oil for Duelund Copper in Oil. (better in every way) The problems are when the poly cap goes in the network designed for foil.

Thanks guys I will do some location switching on the coil to see if that is it.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Undertow

I am not looking for a miracle cap.

But what if the there is a reason to wrap the inductor in wax paper? What if Mr klipsch knew something?

Most people agree Duelund makes great sounding parts. What's "new" about them? Paper, copper, cocoon silk and natural oils have all been around for 100's of millions of years!

Yes the North Creek is a monster of an inductor but it does use varnish. There is no paper and no dampening between the wires. In defence of Frederik there is clearly a difference in time of construction. I hoped (in a strange way) that Frederik is just being obsessive and I could not hear what his paper and oil does. (for cost reasons) I did tell Frederik the second best cap in the mid range (I tested) was the original Aluminum foil in oil (wayyy better than all the rest) and in fact I would love to hear it compared to Duelund's (Aluminum) because I bet I may not tell the difference.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Undertow

I thought you owned Khorns? You will be glad to know they sell new in Europe for $20k a pair. Those will not come with the Alnico magnets though just the cheap ferrite ones. I seen in a British Audio Magazine a set of 30 year old Lascala's for 6,000 pounds or $10k U.S.. Yes I know they go for nowhere near that here. I am sure no doubt the SET crowd is bidding up high eff speakers across the pond.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Now I find the article Steen had wrote on inductors?

I believe the vintage is Steel Laminate wrapped in wax paper.

http://www.meta-gizmo.net/Tri/speak/jenson.html

This does have my hopes up though of the oil filled power supply caps. Steen was a fan of oil in the power supply.

I am going to try some Jensen paper tube caps .02uf in the amp in the sizes that Duelund does not make. I have learned enough lessons on this stuff and was glad to hear Steen liked the oil power supply and it is made by Jensen.

I am going to move the inductor up to 10'away from the speaker and see if that helps if it still sounds hard does anyone want to buy a never hooked up inductor?

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