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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Ait

I believe you are right as well. I believe the ones Steen was talking about are these at Jensen?

https://audio.jensencapacitors.com/products/capmetpape/?crumbs

I think polyproplyne would be very good in the power supply. Even as one who does not like them in the signal path poly is very good at doing one of the two things caps do and that is getting out noise. I don't care for what they do to the signal but of course they are not in the signal when in the power supply.

I have been giving more thought to Paul Klipsch's inductor. It is not the standard steel laminate inductor that we see most often but a upside down M. I wonder if metal on the outside is to stop stay magnetic field? In my tweeter circuit the resonant trap is air core wax paper inductor. So he clearly knew of the "benefits" of air core but did not use it? I know most would say for cost reasons (which could be true) but this was not a cheaply made inductor like many of today's? He could have not done a M and no wax paper to save even more money.

In the Klipsch post I copied in Al Klappenberger was shocked at how little distortion the metal core had? He had believed Air to be much better.

Another guy in the post talked about using a large inductor and being able to disconnect the tweeter and only lost 20db of output! That is clearly NOT good. In fact to me that sounds like what is going on. My mids and highs sound rough with new inductor?

Haven't had a chance to check but it was mentioned here before of surprising level of cross talk. Paul K has gone to it seems great effort to stop that.

I am going to do some more tinkering to see what can be done.
davidpritchard's avatar
davidpritchard
866 posts
 
Volleyguy,
Have you installed the Duelund hook up wire to your speakers? I look forward to your impressions.
David Pritchard
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
David

It is not here yet for some reason? I expect Monday.

Did you hook up your parts yet?

Crosstalk.
I disonnected the tweeter wire and there is no crosstalk into the tweeter.
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
Well George (North Creek) was right. You will notice the inductor mostly though the mid range. Not what I would have expected.

The not so good part is the vintage is clearly the better inductor! Much smoother in the mid range the back ground is much blacker as well and there is much better separtion of instruments. Much more musical sounding.

The wax paper is not there for no reason!

The Duelund WPIO is $429 each and this is out of the range for me. I am unsure if or how much better it would be anyway?

The vintage inductor sounds better than the $150 North Creek and could be worth (in new prices) somewhere between $200 or $300?

I was thinking of replacing the parallel tweeter air core wax paper inductor and am not going to do that (at least for a long time) as only a Duelund WPIO (or similiar like Jensen) would be the only one worth it. They are almost $200 each.

I feel with Jensen and Duelund caps in the amp is a better place for the $ right now.

If I could only find out for sure that they were Aluminum Foil in Mylar caps. No one seems to know what they were?
volleyguy OP
789 posts
 
I have been reading some Audio Note stuff and the only thing that concerns me about spending money on a old amp is I have not heard as SET amp. (Dave says I have the speakers for the amp 104db)

I love this quote from AN artice. I am wondering if my amp is not old enough! After all SET is older than EL84.

"To my astonishment, the most successful products at coping with “Comparison by Contrast” were more than 15 years old (in 1980, that is!) and the further back I went the better some of the products, especially the amplifiers, turned out to be".
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