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Capacitor log Mundorf Silver in Oil

I wished I could find a log with information on caps. I have found many saying tremendous improvement etc. but not a detailed account of what the changes have been. I have had the same speakers for many years so am very familiar with them. (25+ years) The speakers are a set of Klipsch Lascala's. They have Alnico magnets in the mids and ceramic woofers and tweeters. The front end is Linn LP12 and Linn pre amp and amp. The speaker wire is 12 gauge and new wire.

I LOVE these speakers around 1 year ago they started to sound like garbage. As many have said they are VERY sensitive to the components before them. They are also showing what I think is the effect of worn out caps.

There are many out here on these boards I know of that are using the Klipsch (heritage) with cheaper Japanese electronics because the speakers are cheap! (for what they can do) One thing I would recommend is give these speakers the best quality musical sources you can afford. There is a LOT to get out of these speakers. My other speakers are Linn speakers at around 4k new with Linn tri-wire (I think about 1k for that) and the Klipsch DESTROY them in my mind. If you like "live feel" there is nothing like them. In fact it shocks me how little speakers have improved in 30 years (or 60 years in the Khorns instance)

In fact I question Linn's theory (that they have proved many times) that the source is the most important in the Hi-Fi chain. Linn's theory is top notch source with lessor rest of gear including speakers trumps expensive speakers with lessor source. I think is right if all things are equal but Klipsch heritage are NOT equal! They make a sound and feel that most either LOVE or hate. (I am in the LOVE camp and other speakers are boring to me)

So here goes and I hope this helps guys looking at caps in the future. Keep in mind Klipsch (heritage Khorns Belle's and Lascala's especially) are likely to show the effects of crossover changes more then most.

1 The caps are 30 years old and
2 the speakers being horn driven make changes 10x times more apparent.

Someone once told me find speakers and components you like THEN start to tweak if needed. Don't tweak something you not in love with. Makes sense to me.

So sound
Record is Let it Be (Beatles)
The voices are hard almost sounds like a worn out stylus.
Treble is very hard. I Me Mine has hard sounding guitars. Symbals sound awful. Everything has a digital vs. analog comparison x50! Paul's voice not as bad as John's and George's. Voices will crack.

different lp
Trumpets sound awful. Tambourine terrible. Bass is not great seems shy (compared to normal) but the bad caps draw soooooo much attention to the broken up mid range and hard highs that are not bright if anything it seems the highs are not working up to snuff. I have went many times to speaker to make sure tweeters are even working.

All in all they sound like crap except these Klipsch have such fantastic dynamics that even when not right they are exciting!

Makes me wonder about the people who do not like them if they are hearing worn out caps and cheap electronics? Then I can see why they do not like them! If I did not know better from 25+ years of ownership that would make sense.

For the new crossover I have chosen Mundorf Silver in Oil from what I have read and can afford. I want a warm not overly detailed sound as Klipsch already has lots of detail and does not need to be "livened up" they need lush smooth sounding caps. Hope I have made the right choice?

When the crossover is in I will do a initial impression on same lp's. Right now it goes from really bad (on what may be worn vinyl) to not as bad but NOT great on great vinyl. (I know the quality of the vinyl because tested on other speakers Linn)

The new caps are Mundorf Silver in Oil and new copper foil inductors are coming. I will at the same time be rewiring the speakers to 12 guage from the lamp cord that PWK put in. PWK was a master at getting very good sound often with crap by today's standards components.

The choice of speakers would be a toss up now depending on what I am listening to. Klipsch vastly more dynamic but if the breaking up of the sound becomes to much to effect enjoyment the Linn would be a better choice on that Lp. If I could I would switch a button back and forth between speakers depending on song and how bad the break-up sound was bothering me.

volleyguy
irish65
170 posts
 
John,

That being your experience with the inductors I would suggest getting the inductors first. Leave the rest of the Xover as is just change out the inductors.

Let it settle in then evaluate them if they bring any improvement. If you like what they bring to the table then get the Clarity MR 4.7uF cap for the tweeter. I mention this first because this is where you mentioned in your post above that the tweeter with the Duelund cap was faster than the mids/bass because of the inductor.

Once you install them leave them for a few hundred hours and continue to evaluate what you are hearing. If you are happy with it then get the 15uF Clarity MR caps followed by the Cast resistors.

The benefits of this approach is you will gain a working knowledge of what each part in a Xover contributes to the overall sonics and what effect they have on each other. Also you won't put out the scratch for the costly 15uF Clarity MR caps prematurely.
ait
480 posts
 
A cheap experiment might be to just pot the stock inductors in some type of ABS container using epoxy potting compound. That will eliminate the noise from vibrating loosely-wound coils and give some of the effect of a CAST-type inductor while keeping the same inductance and DCR value. If you're just going to toss them then it might be an interesting experiment anyway.
irish65
170 posts
 
Ait,

I was going to mention that also but the 3m product to use costs around 15.00-20.00 per tube. From my experience you would need around (5) tubes to do a 14 awg 1.2mH inductor properly. While your add it cut channels for the inductor wire to travel, in the botton of the xover box, and fill this channel with the potting compound.
irish65
170 posts
 
Correction of my last post. It should say" While your at it" not "While your add it".
reynolds853
386 posts
 
Irish and Ait,

Thank you both for your replies and for your suggestions about the inductors. My primary motivation for this project is not actually the improvements brought by the inductors per se but rather the improvements that I know an upgrade in capacitors and resistors will make.

On the earlier SR17.5 speaker project, that speaker was a 2-way monitor with a 1st order crossover. There was a single capacitor and resistor going to the tweeter, and a single inductor on the mid/bass driver. I heard the benefit from the capacitor/resistor change, but decided that if I ever did anything like this again that I was going to replace the inductors as well, it is only a question of which type to use.

The experience you and others have shared on this thread has been tremendously helpful and appreciated. I know that I am not going to get the improvements I would if I were to use Duelund (I'm a big fan of that company and its products) but I am confident that I am on a path that will yield very good crossover nonetheless.

Again, thank you for sharing your experience and for taking the time to post your response.

John
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